Toby99

There have been many TSB's for this issue.  None have fixed my 2019 Titanium.  30k miles.

https://www.fordedgeforum.com/topic/26728-2019-edge-low-speed-surgebuck/

Could you keep us updated on whether the described repairs fixed the issue? 

My 2019 Edge is still having slow speed buck/surges after 4-1/2 years.  Numerous TSB's and PCM resets have done nothing.  Worst vehicle I have ever owned.  

On 7/7/2022 at 11:17 AM, Breez said:

Unplugged my EGR valve. Surge/hitching gone. Maybe that will fix it, will let you all know. BTW should be covered under power train warranty. 

 

Breez,  Can you explain the connection between the EGR valve and the bucking/surging issue we are having?    

Is this actually an engine problem and not transmission? 

Customer support is worthless and I (we) have no direct access to Ford technicial engineering.  Just odd to me that no one who has read or posted here are Ford repair techs or a Ford employee.  Whether Ford acknowledges it or not there is something wrong with our vehicles.  I've lost count on how many TSB's I've had done and resetting the PCM.  It's not fixing the problem.  I'm also frustrated with dealership service departments that state there are no codes or could not duplicate the problem.

Thanks.  Mine will bounce at each shift.  As rpm increases and the tach/engine reaches the shift point, the rpm will drop, then increases about 300 rpm, then settles back down.  Does it all the time at each shift.

Icy,

Looked at your video.  Did you see the tach bounce at each shift or at a steady speed?  I asked my dealer service to looked at that specific issue.  They claimed they could not duplicate issue.  How did you get your service department to diagnosis the torque converter?

Same here.  28k miles.  No change.  Problem persists.

I'm on the phone with customer service.   Same response as always.  "CS can't provide any technical support.  Need to take the vehicle to the dealership service department."   Asked to speak to a supervisor.  Was transferred to a survey.  After answering the questions, phone disconnected.

Anyone know if there is a reason why I have two, what look to be, drill holes in the muffler?  Just noticed them today.  Saw a black streak along the muffler's bottom.  Started the vehicle and felt a small air flow.  On closer inspection I noticed two holes.  

Lazy Ford engineering and poor quality control.  My 2000 Explorer had a three speed fan for rear seating.  Never had a cooling problem.  

Had a thought as to why are vehicle issue has not been resolved.

Last time I picked up my Edge the technician mentioned he does not get paid unless the vehicle is fixed.  Didn't think much about that statement since we were still discussing the vehicle's problems.  Is that a correct statement or maybe varies with dealership? 

If true, the techs know Ford is not providing a valid fix so they don't spend any time diagnosing the problem or attempting a fix. Ford hasn't provided one.  Why waste time on a job that will not be fixed and see no payment for the time spent. 

Same with mine but at slower speed, 15 -20 mph.

I took my 2019 Edge in again.  Dealership had the vehicle for a month.  Was told TSB 21-2389 was done.  I never asked for a ticket so I don't know if that is true.  Still have the issue.

Also asked to check the bouncing tach at each shift and the sensitive throttle pedal.  Still have both of those issues.

12 hours ago, MNTBrew said:

 

I  noticed that you said the dealership reset your PCM, does that mean they simply cleared the shift adapts or did they actually reprogram the PCM to the most current version?  I have no idea what they claim they did to the vehicle.  I'm just quoting what is written on the service ticket.  Whatever was done, does not and has not corrected the problem.   I don't usually go by what a dealership says because I have come across far too many situations where a dealership says there is not an issue and yet there is a tsb that addresses the problem word for word or they just "reset" or clear the PCM memory.  As far as the tsb being updated to include new model years, that happens all the time because software glitches can occur regardless of how up to date the software is.  Yes, true, but that's not how the TSB description was written.  What difference does "new model" make if the new Edge is still using the 2019 version transmission? I know it affects the 8F35 transmission, period, no matter what year vehicle it's in so why mention "Carry over to new model".  The new TSB is because the problem is still not fixed.  And in my situation, three full years and one month.  Vehicle is still sitting at the service department for now eight business days and has not been looked at yet.  Personal computers and phones have updates all the time. Another example is the ZF nine speed that Honda has used since 2015. Just last year Honda released another software update for MDX and TLX models spanning from 2015  to 2020 that had to do with hard shifting. Regards, Jason

Interesting update.  Another TSB.

I took my Edge in again for service Wednesday Jan 7th.  Gave the service manager a copy of the issues and the letter from Customer Care.

Buck and jerk was the main issue.  I also asked to check why the tach bounces on each shift and the sensitive accelerator.  On Friday I received a call stating the tech believed it could be a torque converter problem. Waiting to hear from Ford.  I also received a call from Customer Care.  Stated the same. 

Curious why the TSB wasn't mentioned since it's dated 4 November 2021.  Not that I trust the TSB to correct the problem.  We've all been down that road many times before.

Will update once I know more.

Just re-read the TSB.  "This bulletin supersedes 21-2081.  Reason for update. Concern Carrover to New Model".  Not, we didn't fix the problem with all the other TSB's or replace the poorly designed transmission.  It's only because the new model owners are now complaining.

On 12/28/2021 at 10:24 PM, MNTBrew said:

Thanks for posting.  I'll do my best to answer.

This question is mostly directed at Toby99 but anyone that is experiencing the bucking/shudder/jerk condition with the 8F35 and 8F57 transmission.  When you say that your vehicle has a buck/shudder/jerk condition, does your vehicle physically jerk or lurch forward when the transmission shifts?  Yes.   If so, what gear do you think it is shifting to?  1st to 2nd.  Driving slowly, 15 - 20 mph.   I ask because I work as an Auto Tech at an independent shop and quite often I will have a vehicle in my bay for a specific issue but I am unable to replicate the concern per the customers description. At this point I have to talk to the customer myself and sometimes have them drive the vehicle for me so I can observe what the issue is that they are having. The reason for this is that a description of an issue can mean something to one person and something completely different to another person.  I have had two service techs in the vehicle while I was driving.  Both felt it.  One suggested I drive faster.  Both said it was "normal operation".  At another dealershiip the service tech drove the vehicle and experienced the issue.  Even documented it on the ticket.  He called Ford but nothing was done other then resetting the PCM.    A couple observations of mine that relate to the 8 speed auto and transmission tuning in general. The first is that I have driven a couple of the new escapes   I drove an Escape as a loner vehicle from a third dealership.  No issues.  Transmission shifted better than my Edge.   with the 8 speed transaxle, it may be a smaller version than the 8F35 but I'm not sure, and the only shifting or transmission issue that I noticed was the tachometer bounced twice after the 2-3 shift as I accelerated through an intersection and the 2-3 shift occured as I went through the low spot on the other end of the crown in the road and that caused my foot to bounce on the gas pedal slightly.  Yes, and I have asked mutiple times in earlier posts if the accelerator pedal sensitivity is adjustable.  I have also noticed I have a problem holding the rpm at a set number.  I first noticed this when I had the oil changed and was asked to hold the rpm at 2000.  I could not.  It was either idle or over 2000, close to 2500.  That's why I thought the problem might be an over sensitive accelerator causing an upshift shift, and then slightly lifting your foot causing a downshift.   My guess is that the throttle is some what touchy and that is what caused the rpm bounce and a slight shudder feeling when that happened.  I too have always seen a bouncing tach. I do not see a solid shift when looking at the tach on either upshift or downshifts.  I always see a bounce in the tach.   The rest of my time driving the Escape, the roads were smooth and I never experienced that issue again. My other observation has to due with late model transmission tuning for most 6 speed and higher ratio count transmissions. On most newer automatics the torque convertor will lock up fairly early in the ratio spread, generally in 2nd or 3rd gear already, and that can be described as a transmission slip or shudder depending on a persons sensitivity or understanding of the transmission operation. Quite often the way the torque convertor lock up function is programed, results in the 2-3 shift then a slight rpm increase and about 2 seconds later the rpms will drop again, that is the torque convertor locking up. I have had customers who swore their transmission was slipping or described it as a shudder because the rpms dropped a second time in such short succession when that second "shift" occurred which again is the torque convertor locking up.  I have owned many vehicles, most Ford but other domestic and foreign.  I have never, and I mean never experienced such horribly designed transmission.  My last vehicle was a 2000 Ford Explorer with 275k miles.  With the original transmission, it shifted better than my 2019 Edge Titanium.   This is a long post I know but sometimes the key to fixing a vehicle or confirming that it is in fact working correctly is understanding what the customer is experiencing in person or making sure that we are both on the same page as far as what they are describing.  What I fail to understand is why Ford will not or can not fix the problem.  If it's only my vehicle, replace the transmission with one that works properly. Problem fixed.  Lets say the headlights turn off intermitently. Would you be satified if Ford said no one else is reporting a similar problem.  Or not enought people have reported the problem so we are not going to fix your lights?  No!  At this point I believe the problem is a badly designed transmission or transmission software and Ford isn't interested in fixing it hoping people will just accept it.  It's that or people will tire of the issue and trade.  Either way the problem is still there.  Hope this has helping in some way.  It's all I can offer which to me is more than Ford has  done.

 

On 11/30/2021 at 12:07 PM, 52K said:

My story is basically the same as 95% of the posters on this thread. 2019 Edge Titanium bucks and surges at low speeds. Three times to dealership, no change. 

 

Question: Has anyone tried one of these after market performance modules that retune your vehicle? Expensive, but if it worked, I'd spend the money.

I haven't.  If you decide to give it a try please let us know the outcome.

On 11/23/2021 at 10:09 PM, rafeeki said:

I have the same problem with my 2019 edge built before Nov 2018

On a whim I thought of mixing it up and used S mode then went back to regular mode. 

There was a marked improvement.

 

I also tried using my paddle shifter and got up to 8th gear, it has to be at approx. 2000rpm or greater to kick in.

 

My suspicion is it has to do with oil flow in the unit but that is my uninformed suspicion.

 

It's worth trying it.

I believe it's a badly designed transmission.  Don't believe Ford has any plans to replace the ones that are defective.  If it was simply a software problem, why all the TSB's that have done nothing.

On 11/10/2021 at 3:28 PM, Breez said:

Toby99, I would present that letter to the service manager, also ask if he would submit a hotline request, if they don't find the problem. 

Great suggestion.  Have a copy ready.

That's not good news.  I have service scheduled for Jan 2022.  Should I even bother.

Several months ago I sent another series of letters to Ford management.  A week ago I received a letter from "Marguita" Customer Service Representative.  Recommended I schedule service "for a more up-to-date diagnosis to determine the cause of any symptoms........."  

I guess I'll give Ford one more try a identifing the problem and fixing it.

Thought I'd ask this again.  Does anyone else experience a very sensitive throttle response?  With the vehicle idling, if I slightly touch the accelator with my foot the engine revs to 2000 rpm.  I can't do slight increases in rpm.  It's either idle or 2000.  If I try to release pressure on the accelator the rpm goes back to idle.  

Is there an adjustment in the computer that controls throttle sensitivity? 

Curious if anyone reading this thread is an actual Ford certified tech.  Do you have any information you can share regarding this issue? 

Is Ford aware/acknowledged there is a problem?

Is Ford actually doing anything constructive to resolve it?  Published TSB's haven't worked.

Hey Breez,

Please keep us informed to the outcome.  I'm also planning another service visit.

I mailed yet another letter to Ford the first of September.  So far silence.  I guess electric F- trucks are of more importance.

On 9/12/2021 at 6:03 PM, Daniel Fonseca said:

I'm also having the same issue, are there any resolution yet by Ford?

Nope.  I've been dealing with the problem for going on three years.  Will probably schedule another service visit.

On 9/4/2021 at 9:37 PM, ajhart1000 said:

My 2019 Edge Titanium is also having the low speed bucking transmission issues. I was wondering if anyone else has heard a metal clank or knocking noise from the transmission as you let off the pedal? It does not do it every time, but the noise happens a few times on every drive. This has started, or finally noticed, in the last couple months of driving. I have not had TSB-21-2081 performed yet. It is the clank and knocking noise that makes me wonder if something is really wrong. Please reply if you are hearing a metal clank or knocking noise. 

Haven't heard a knocking noise other than when auto engine shut off restarts the engine when releasing the brake.  It annoys me so I turn it off everytime I start the vehicle.

You could have the TSB performed and see if the helps.  Nothing Ford nas done so far has fixed the problem.

On 8/10/2021 at 12:39 PM, DGW said:

 I buy my cars and try to keep them for a long time.   I

Me too.  In Janurary 2019 I traded a 2000 Explorer XLT with 275,000 miles for the 2019 Edge Titanium.  Explorer ran perfectly.  And what do I receive for my vehicle loyalty to Ford? 

On 8/31/2021 at 8:50 PM, steamroll9 said:

I have a 2019 Edge Titanium, 2.0.  Since day one I always though the transmission was a bit funky.  After doing some searching, I found this topic and others regarding the transmission.  I have the low speed bucking and at times it just felt like it was a stick car and I was going into to high of a gear and the car feels hesitant to move.  Due the pandemic and other life issues, I've only put 9500 miles on the car since October of 2019.  I know the most common thins dealers do is reset the Transmission programming, and as I don't drive the car that much, I had no desire to deal with it "learning" for months.  I have also read by many that it doesn't do anything really.  It wasn't so horrible that I wasn't unable to drive it, so I was just going to monitor this post till a hopeful resolution came up.  As I have the car for awhile now and reading some of the posts, I'm not actually 100% positive that it's the transmission that is the issue.  

If not the transmission, any idea what it could be?  Ford could use the help. 

I asked this in the above post.  Can you check to see if your vehicle has difficulty keeping a steady rpm.  Place transmission in neutral, set parking brake, then try to raise rpm to 2000 from idle. 

On 8/31/2021 at 8:50 PM, steamroll9 said:

 

On one or two occasions last year, I was noticing on hot days, first time driving that day, with the AC blasting, I would drive a few blocks and stop at a light.  Right when I would come to a full stop the car would start shaking while stopped.  First time freaked me out and I was checking my heart rate.  lol.  It happened another time, and honestly forgot to mention in when I brought the car in for regular service.  Fast forward to this summer, and it's doing it more frequently and shaking far worse.  The hotter the day, the worse it is. I have tried shutting off the AC, while it gets better, it's still there.  If I put he car in park/neutral, shaking goes away.  When the car is shaking and I take my foot of the brake and coast, the car jerks forward and will keep jerking till I give it a little gas.  It does this for roughly 15 min, during that time, the severity of the shaking/jerking decreases.  When I get in it at night, I do not experience the shaking, but the car definitely hesitates at times.  I started to realizing the bucking I was feeling and was thinking was the transmission since I got the car, might not be the transmission.  The jerking I was experiencing while coasting from a stop, felt like it was just a more exaggerated low speed surge/bucking that I was experiencing since I got the car.  I'm thinking it's a fuel system issue, possibly.

 

I feel like the low speed surge/bucking is the car hesitating from idle.  This hesitation feels very similar to when the fuel filter on my 1983 regal & my 1986 cavalier would clog.  That issue never really presented itself unless you were taking off from a full stop, but the hesitation my Edge is having feels very familiar(it was a century ago lol).  Now this may not be everybody experience/issue, but was wondering if anyone else has experienced/feels that this might be the issue.  I will be taking my car in next month and will discuss with my service department.  I'm sure it will be cold by then and they "won't be able to reproduce it", as it happens with most issues I try to get fixed.  

I suspect it could be a sensitive throttle sensor.  Why I asked about holding the rpm at 2000.  I experience it too.  The hesitation is either idle rpm or 2000+ which may cause the transmission to not know what gear to be in.  Slightly remove your foot off the pedal and engine goes back to idle causing a downshift.  Touch the pedal again and now engine is back to 2000+ and upshift. 

Someone also mentioned in a post they did not have the problem if using cruise control at a slow speed.  I don't recall if you can set cruise at 15-20 mph.  If the pedal sensor is the problem that could explain why we feel and see the bucking using the pedal but not when using cruise control.

On 8/31/2021 at 8:50 PM, steamroll9 said:

Couple of things;

I always fill up with Mobil super(don't pay for gas)

Auto start/stop is turned off permanently (once I found out a windows laptop and and $18 reader would get rid of that, I was like sign me up!!! lol)

 

Again, might not be everybody's experience, but would love to hear your opinions.

 

Sorry for being soooo long winded....

 

 

Also, please consider a letter to Ford.

On 8/30/2021 at 6:28 AM, CHRISN85 said:

Has anyone found a resolution to this problem experiencing this on my 2020 Ford Edge SEL, like everyone's notes low speeds way worse first thing in the morning or after work never a smooth shift at low speeds and I have hesitation. (I think that scares me the most, especially driving in Florida...) as well as a rocking when stopped after the autostart kicks the vehicle back on. So glad I'm not the only one who's experienced this. But dissapointed just the same. The rocking happened once when I very first brought it home but then stopped. It's worse when the air is on.  but the surging started a few months ago. So far they have replaced my TSB and an O2 sensor. Been in the shop 3 times each time more than 2 weeks. For the O2 sensor it was a month. Neither has fixed and it got worse after the TSB replacement. 

A resolution from Ford, No.  I'm almost at three years dealing with this issue and Ford.

Please consider mailing a letter to Ford management explaining your issue and lack of a fix.  Here's the address:

Ford Motor Company

1 American Rd.

Dearborn, MI 48126  

Attention:

William Clay Ford Jr., Executive Chairman

James D. Farley, Jr. Chief Executive Officer

Dave Filipe, Vice President, Vehicle Hardware Modules

Elena Ford,  Chief Customer Experience Officer

If I could ask, can you check to see if your vehicle has difficulty keeping a steady rpm.  Place transmission in neutral, set parking brake, then try to raise rpm to 2000 from idle.  I can not.  I found this problem when having the engine oil changed.  Tech asked me to raise the rpm up to 2000.  Couldn't do it.  Either idle or near 3000. 

DGW,

Thanks for posting your vehicle's issues.  While I too deal with the problem daily, I am concerned about what could be happening long term.  What happens a month after the warranty expires and we have massive drive train failure.  Do you think Ford will cover it?

What ever anyone thinks, and in my opinion,  the bucking/surging is not "normal" to any transmission.  If it was, wouldn't all vehicles do it?  No, it's lazy engineering and Ford management's lack of concern.  

All I know is, if you ever go to sell the vehicle do it when the engine and transmission have warmed to operating temperature.