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Poor trans shifting theory investigation

Poor Trans shifting theory  

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58 minutes ago, dajo2012 said:

We are looking to buy a ST.  All of these transmission issues have me worried about even buying one. Are most of the problems posted on earlier production models or are there some newer production models still having the issues.  It would be nice to know the build dates. If we buy a 2020 made after October will we be safe and not have all these problems? How about 2019 made in August of this year, they have some great discounts. Thanks

Maybe I'm the only one experiencing what I posted about the other day, but I can't imagine that I am since I drove another new Edge ST sitting on the dealers lot and had the same issue, but the transmission is one thing I HATE about this vehicle. Honestly, I regret buying it at this point. My vehicle has been in the shop more than 3 weeks out of the last few months since I bought it in late August (multiple problems). My vehicle has a build date of 7/22/19 if I remember correctly.

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Mine was built in mid Aug. After applying the trans fix more than a month ago, in the first couple of days I had two harsh switching from R to D (much weaker than before the fix). Since then the trans is flawless. Altogether, I'm happy with this fix. For now...😁

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3 hours ago, dajo2012 said:

We are looking to buy a ST.  All of these transmission issues have me worried about even buying one. Are most of the problems posted on earlier production models or are there some newer production models still having the issues.  It would be nice to know the build dates. If we buy a 2020 made after October will we be safe and not have all these problems? How about 2019 made in August of this year, they have some great discounts. Thanks

 

Bought my 2019 in September 2019.  Built August 2019.   It has the Trans issues, but I haven't had a chance to get back to the dealer yet.  Only have 1,000 miles on it and waiting to see what else the dealer has to address.  Other than that, I am happy with it.  

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My Edge ST, DOB 12/18/2018, had the same symptoms.

It has been corrected by the TSB.

 

Most of these issues are going to be software fixes since our vehicles have mechanical parts with software controlled electrical counterparts.

Anything that effects the electrical parts performing in harmony with the mechanical parts is going to cause problems that FEEL just like it is a mechanical problem.

I have overt 12,500 miles on my ST now and I am pretty confident that with the amount of maintenance that I give my vehicles,

this Edge ST is going to last a very long time.

 

Pete...

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4 hours ago, dajo2012 said:

We are looking to buy a ST.  All of these transmission issues have me worried about even buying one. Are most of the problems posted on earlier production models or are there some newer production models still having the issues.  It would be nice to know the build dates. If we buy a 2020 made after October will we be safe and not have all these problems? How about 2019 made in August of this year, they have some great discounts. Thanks

 

I have had my ST for almost a year and 12,000 miles.  Sure it had some trans shifting or harsh engagements but nothing that makes me regret leasing it.  My only regret is that I did not do a 12,000mi/yr lease and did 10,500.  The trans is a new unit and this is the first vehicle they stuck it in.  So the software is not right, but it is software and that can be updated and it has.  The latest builds will have the most up to date software so if you order it then it should come all updated and ready.  Should they have figured this out by now, maybe, but the only way to learn and find little quirks is to get the vehicle out there.  People on a Forum are going to be the ones that bitch about them the most.  The average buyer probably will never drive an ST near its limits and may not notice or care about the issues mentioned in the ST for the trans.  I mean I drive mine like I am running from the cops, an active pursuit, most of the times and I love it.  And mine has only spent time at the dealer to get the 2 TSB trans updates and oil changes.  It did go in to get some straps replaced on the fuel tank which was a TSB as well.  My dad works there so he drives it in and I take his Escape for the day. 

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The St we are looking at was built the day before the bulletin 19-2313, Oct 17th.  It is a 2020 and only 2019 are listed on the bulletin. Wish I could find out it the update has been done. I am sure dealer won't look at it since it states 2019 on the bulletin. Local dealer here in AZ of course say they have not seen any problems, typical dealer BS.

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23 minutes ago, dajo2012 said:

The St we are looking at was built the day before the bulletin 19-2313, Oct 17th.  It is a 2020 and only 2019 are listed on the bulletin. Wish I could find out it the update has been done. I am sure dealer won't look at it since it states 2019 on the bulletin. Local dealer here in AZ of course say they have not seen any problems, typical dealer BS.

Are you able to take that ST for a test drive?

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I should be able to test drive at least before paperwork is signed due to all the problems.

I forgot to ask is the date code toward the bottom of window sticker under the MSRP reliable for build date?

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1 hour ago, dajo2012 said:

I should be able to test drive at least before paperwork is signed due to all the problems.

I forgot to ask is the date code toward the bottom of window sticker under the MSRP reliable for build date?

Yes definitely they should let you drive it as much as you like. They let me take it home (this dealer was 20 miles away) to show my wife (a sales tactic--but I used it to my advantage).   Meanwhile the dealership I could walk to (and did get the TSB applied at and walked home to wait) did not want to come down the $1.5K more I wanted off their third-time-with-the-manager offer, but the boondocks guy did.  At least my service location is close.

 

Anyway, everything I've read says that last set of numbers--which is a date--is the build date. Mine's a 2019 model built 3/7/2019.

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20 hours ago, dajo2012 said:

The St we are looking at was built the day before the bulletin 19-2313, Oct 17th.  It is a 2020 and only 2019 are listed on the bulletin. Wish I could find out it the update has been done. I am sure dealer won't look at it since it states 2019 on the bulletin. Local dealer here in AZ of course say they have not seen any problems, typical dealer BS.

 

I am going to go out on a limb and say the 2020's were probably already updated since they hopefully worked out all the software by the time they were released.  Most of the TSB's only apply to vehicles built before a certain date, not the date the software fix was released.  They update the vehicles being built with new software before they send it to the public. 

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https://youtu.be/KZF6kdYEc3Y

 

This is a video I did today showing the behavior of the issue I am seeing. Anyone else have this same issue? It happens in all drive modes, just easiest to see and reproduce using sport with the paddles.

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1 hour ago, boosted_st said:

https://youtu.be/KZF6kdYEc3Y

 

This is a video I did today showing the behavior of the issue I am seeing. Anyone else have this same issue? It happens in all drive modes, just easiest to see and reproduce using sport with the paddles.

I didn't hear any sound for some reason but it appears that, while it displays 3rd gear, it then displays 4th with no RPM drop indicating that it was probably in 4th to begin with, so it's skipping 3rd.  Is that what you're saying?  Because I think mine skips 3rd as well, but I haven't looked closely since the TSB.

 

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35 minutes ago, Jombi said:

I didn't hear any sound for some reason but it appears that, while it displays 3rd gear, it then displays 4th with no RPM drop indicating that it was probably in 4th to begin with, so it's skipping 3rd.  Is that what you're saying?  Because I think mine skips 3rd as well, but I haven't looked closely since the TSB.

 

That's 100% what is happening, it almost acts like it should shift into 3rd from 2nd, but it doesn't. Then hangs for 4th longer than other gear changes.

 

You are dead on about the sound (I could add it back) but the mount I was using to hold the camera was rubbing on the steering wheel with each turn and it was really annoying in the video and though I would save everyone's ears lol.

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The same thing was happening with my ST and the TSB Update corrected the problem and I have not had any issues for the last 3,000 miles.

I have 12,600 miles on my ST now.

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1 minute ago, MENINBLK said:

The same thing was happening with my ST and the TSB Update corrected the problem and I have not had any issues for the last 3,000 miles.

I have 12,600 miles on my ST now.

I wish I could say the same, I've had multiple software updates to the car with no luck on that part. There have been 3 software updates in the almost 4 months I have owned it.

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What you are describing is exactly the problem I was having, but I could reproduce it at a much lower RPM.

I took my car out with the technician sitting next to me and he saw, heard and felt the shift.

Third would release and fourth was very, very slow to engage.

It did it worse when it was cold. As it warmed up it was not as bad.

After the flash, they told me to drive it for a few days.

They reset the KAM (keep alive memory) in the PCM along with the flash.

The owners manual says it takes at least 12 miles for the transmission to relearn to shift.

 

The only issue I have now, is if you let the ST coast on level ground, at 5-7 mph,

it will shift up and slightly accelerate.

 

With as many software updates as you have had, I would be asking for a replacement transmission.

It is very clear that software is not your problem.

 

Pete...

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10 hours ago, MENINBLK said:

What you are describing is exactly the problem I was having, but I could reproduce it at a much lower RPM.

I took my car out with the technician sitting next to me and he saw, heard and felt the shift.

Third would release and fourth was very, very slow to engage.

It did it worse when it was cold. As it warmed up it was not as bad.

After the flash, they told me to drive it for a few days.

They reset the KAM (keep alive memory) in the PCM along with the flash.

The owners manual says it takes at least 12 miles for the transmission to relearn to shift.

 

The only issue I have now, is if you let the ST coast on level ground, at 5-7 mph,

it will shift up and slightly accelerate.

 

With as many software updates as you have had, I would be asking for a replacement transmission.

It is very clear that software is not your problem.

 

Pete...

I should hopefully be getting a tech to ride along with me today (I had a service adviser ride along the first time but I guess him seeing the problem never did anything). It's 100% there no matter what RPM it's shifting at, it's just easiest to show the issue at the higher RPM's using the paddle sifters so you see what gear it should be in. On one occasion event the shop foreman drove my vehicle around for like 20 miles and still said "nope, nothing is wrong". I know cars have gotten more complicated with all the tech and computers, but it really feels like if the computer doesn't say there is a problem, then according to dealer (Ford certified) techs there is no problem. They lack the ability to troubleshoot problems on their own anymore. You are also dead on about it being lots worse when cold.

 

I've reset the adaptive learning for the transmissions and also the KAM on my own with no luck. I'm in agreement that it's not software at this point and will be bringing up replacing the transmission to see what they say.

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19 hours ago, boosted_st said:

I should hopefully be getting a tech to ride along with me today (I had a service adviser ride along the first time but I guess him seeing the problem never did anything). It's 100% there no matter what RPM it's shifting at, it's just easiest to show the issue at the higher RPM's using the paddle sifters so you see what gear it should be in. On one occasion event the shop foreman drove my vehicle around for like 20 miles and still said "nope, nothing is wrong". I know cars have gotten more complicated with all the tech and computers, but it really feels like if the computer doesn't say there is a problem, then according to dealer (Ford certified) techs there is no problem. They lack the ability to troubleshoot problems on their own anymore. You are also dead on about it being lots worse when cold.

 

I've reset the adaptive learning for the transmissions and also the KAM on my own with no luck. I'm in agreement that it's not software at this point and will be bringing up replacing the transmission to see what they say.

Don't recall if it was posted here or on Facebook FEWW or Ford Edge ST Nation group, but might help the tech with further investigation, diagnostics.

1317324444_TransWarrantyRepair.thumb.jpg.dcc91b2dd43f6d5fa2c1f28f45dda787.jpg

Edited by ONEDGE16
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Quick update... I got the tech to see what was happening and they agree something isn't right (finally). They did a full wipe of the PCM with a re-program this time thinking it was partly corrupt. I picked it up and went with a test drive with the adviser and the problem is still there. They are going to be contacting ford engineering to see what is suggested.

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1 minute ago, Sage said:

^^^^Hopefully you will get an answer soon^^^^

I hope so too, but it will at least take a few weeks since I couldn't let them keep my vehicle since I am driving out of town for the next 2 weeks and needed my vehicle. Hopefully they can at least get Ford to start looking at what could be going on though.

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The more I read about this in this thread I was wondering if the bucking was the TQ converter locking in lower gears and not unlocking when it should.  I actually had the buck bounce once today because my foot bounced on the gas pedal at low speed when I went over some bumps.  So it bucked like a standard shift would do in like 2nd gear and slowing manipulating the accelerate up and down, like quick taps but not as bad as that would be if you did not disengage the clutch to stop the shenanigans.  And yes I do miss my Standard shift car that I would do that to annoy my passengers. 

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I'm in Northern Cali right now for the holidays and it's decently chilly in the mornings, the shifting for this transmissions when it's cold is horrendous! Maybe there is more wrong with the transmission in my vehicle than I think, but I have never had a transmission shift this poorly when cold. 

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On 12/10/2019 at 4:28 PM, jamie1073 said:

 

I am going to go out on a limb and say the 2020's were probably already updated since they hopefully worked out all the software by the time they were released.  Most of the TSB's only apply to vehicles built before a certain date, not the date the software fix was released.  They update the vehicles being built with new software before they send it to the public. 

I am happy to report my 2020 ST drives and shifts like you would expect a $52,000 car to do.

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