Maavalous1

I created this topic because I wanted to help people and prevent injury and death. I am always grateful to hear someone had the problem and lived to post about it here. I am not so grateful to Ford for ignoring and deflecting the issue. So, I'd like to update everyone with several facts and hopes that we can get Ford to be a big boy and admit they have a problem and fix it. So... 1) Do NOT fall for the lies from the dealer that I was given, "Oh, you just need to have the TB cleaned every oil change. Only $30 extra." This is a defect in the electronics package (black box) on the TB. The TB itself is fine and cleaning it will NOT solve the problem. 2) It is VERY likely that someone has been injured or even killed by this issue. Think about it, how would the investigators pick that needle out of a car wreck haystack? The diagnostics reset if the vehicle is restarted normally and a totaled car doesn't yell "It was my throttle body that caused the wreck." PLEASE! Do NOT relax because you haven't heard of something terrible happening... I am certain it has and I or you might be next. 3) North Carolina won, sort of, a complaint against Ford for this issue related to automobiles. Sadly, the Edge is technically under the truck division so Ford danced around this. But, the NHTSA didn't go near far enough and dropped the ball on this one. All they got was an extension of the warranty to 150,000 miles on select models. Not the Edge or any truck unit vehicles. 4) It is a pretty sad statement when one of the worst auto manufacturers in the world, Fiat, shows Ford up. They issued a recall for 410,000 vehicles affected by a wiring issue that... wait for it... caused loss of power and stalling. It can't get much sadder than seeing Fiat take better care of their loyal customers than Ford :O( You CAN make a difference. Go to the NHTSA (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration) site under Vehicle Owners and file a complaint. Sorry, I don't seem to be able to post links here for some reason. Use safercar.gov There is also a class action lawsuit being prepared by the law firm of Baron and Budd. Google for it and contact them as well. We CAN make a difference if we raise our voices. Please... be safe out there.

For a Moderator to troll the forum is not cool. Yes, the parts are "different" just as an ATT Galaxy phone is "different" from a Verizon Galaxy phone. You clearly have no real understanding of the auto industry if you think that 1) manufacturers don't depend on parts for a huge part of their profit 2) that the dealers "are not Ford". Reality is the TB and door latch are completely fixable problems. There is NO excuse for them to fail at the rate they fail for the YEARS they have been failing. Only one explanation... $$$ And the courts seem to agree with me. Sigh... troll on...

Although it is early yet for 2016 models to have issues, 2015 models are having the issue. And, GM vehicles using the same TB are having tons of issues. In case you were unaware, Ford and GM use the same drivetrains for a number of vehicles. Minor differences but really minor. They have outsourced a ton of their production and often buy from the same supplier. So, before you think Ford or GM is better than the other... think again... parts are made in the same factory. The model of TB doesn't really matter as it's NOT the TB that is the problem it is the electronic black box on the side of the TB. This is a WELL KNOWN problem generating a LOT of $$$ for Ford and GM. North Carolina sued Ford last year and all they could get was an extension of the warranty on the TB to 150k miles for specific vehicles. Sadly, the Edge is not one of them. Ford can afford much better lawyers than the common folk. Two big money makers for Ford are the TB and the door latch so why would they do anything to fix them? I had a Nissan that went 175k without the TB being touched. Funny... must have been something wrong with their design, it just worked.

Woo HOO!! Congratulations KausticRage! You are one of a VERY small number of Ford owners who have gotten anything but the run around on this issue. Good work and a lesson to all. Make a video of the cluster and, if at all possible, have it towed to the dealer and DO NOT let them try to start it before they put it on the diag machine. Glad this worked out for you. Too bad Ford isn't reputable enough to treat paying and loyal customers with respect... sigh. Makes me happy I created this thread to begin with

So, from talking to folks in the Ford service department (off the record because I have contacts who will NOT speak on the record) I know that the issue is NOT going to be helped by cleaning the TB. Word is that, unless you drive in really harsh conditions, the TB only needs to be cleaned every 75-100,000 miles. You many not have the car that long. The issue is actually a badly designed and manufactured TB control module. So, Yes, the best course of action is to buy a new one and replace. Not too difficult and about 1/4 the cost of having the dealer do the work. On the issue of seeing codes. As I've been told, the moment you restart the car the codes will be cleared from the failure event. It's how Ford worms their way around doing the repair under warranty. The only way you can get the code is to NOT start the car after it fails. Have it towed in and DO NOT let the dealer start the car until they pull codes. This is why virtually no one gets warranty repair. Your first instinct after it fails is to try and start it. Hope that helps... since Ford clearly isn't... sigh... Oh, and for the record, I think Ford is a great vehicle. It's the little planned service failures (see door latch failure as well) they put in for extra profit that makes me mad. Love my Edge and would definitely buy another. From what I understand, this issue is fixed in the new redesigned models. We'll see soon enough.

Really AKIRBY... tinfoil hat? I know dealers personally... like backyard barbecue know them. The stories are NOT funny. Do you really think they pay the bills on those elaborate dealerships with the $1,500 they make on selling you a car? Childish and uneducated reply... time for a new moderator on this forum me thinks.

AKIRBY, Don't want to get into a big back/forth on the making money issue. You clearly don't understand the symbiotic relationship that manufacturers have with dealers. Independent businesses is legally correct... but there's a HUGE gray area on how the business actually works. Ford makes a decent markup on the parts they sell to the dealer. The big $$ go to the dealers to help them make even more $$. They make very little on selling cars relative to the huge profit in repairs. Ford knows that full and well. And, WOW! Is there a WIDE range of prices for the same repair. TB replace anywhere from $600 to $900 that I've seen. Makin' some money!

Larry Care... so sorry to hear about your near-collision experience. That is why I started this thread. This is a SERIOUS issue that Ford is using to make service revenue. Just like the Pinto... so long as no one is killed, they make $$$. I have found two cash-cows they are using right now. The Throttle Body and the Door Latch. At 30K miles, my drivers door latch failed. If you search around you'll find this has been a problems with Ford for YEARS and they don't change it. In any case... on your doing your own TB replacement. A friend of mine works at Advanced Auto Parts. He handles the commercial accounts so I asked him to get the inside skinny from one of his Ford dealer customers. He told me that the story he got was two new bits of info: 1) it is the controller, not the TB as a whole that is defective. So, never fall for the "it just needs cleaned" story. Dealers have tried to sell me a $65 cleaning every 15K miles as a preventative. That's BS. Yes, eventually... maybe around 100K miles... a cleaning is a good idea. It will NOT prevent the failure. 2) That they have to "flash" the controller after it is installed. My friend didn't have a lot of details but thought that it is because it's a generic controller for a lot of different cars and the fine tuning is done in the computer. I have not verified that further but you should check on this if you're doing your own repair to be certain. God help us all... Ford is out to get us with the TB issue!!

OK... so we now know that akirby is a troll. And, that he's never bought or installed a throttle body. Moving on... The only way we could "force" action from Ford would be a class action suit. Which, in my experience, means that a lawyer will get a LOT of money and we'll all get a voucher for $20 off the repair. Sad... but most often true. Remember the Pinto... Ford hasn't really grown up much since then it would appear. Truly sad when the quants tell management "we can pay out any lawsuits for less than the cost of a recall". As for me, I can make my decision about Ford very easily now. Known problems, known low-cost solution, NO ACTION. Says all there is to say about Ford. I've put a new TB in my budget and taken Ford off of my list of quality cars.

akirby, Can you be a bit more specific? Which other thread? Warranty extended for what? I have only received a notice of warranty extension for Sync and a brake boot.

With all due respect to our moderator... and not trying to be hostile at all. I am a man just wanting to make sure that the right thing is done. Note, also, that I am a loyal Ford customer who believes in the future of the company enough to own stock. The fact that cars lose power or blow tires every day is certainly true. I doubt seriously that anyone would quietly accept as "just fate" those occurrences being from KNOWN issues. Remember that Firestone almost went out of business not once but twice for ignoring such "common occurrences" with their tires? Can you say "GM ignition switch"? The point of this is that there is a potentially dangerous fault with the 3.5L throttle body that literally everyone is aware of and yet Ford is ignoring it. Turning people away because "it doesn't throw a code" when they get to the dealer. Knowing exactly what the symptoms point to and that it doesn't throw a code unless the event is currently happening. This is simply negligence on Ford's part. I started this thread because a Ford dealer mechanic told me this was a known problem. So much so that TB parts were 3-6 months backordered in 2013. I have been unable to find any other info regarding any other vehicle with chronic TB problems... not even a Chrysler :O) Not saying I have perfect knowledge, but I did a LOT of searching and asked a LOT of mechanics. All I could find is that, sooner or later, they all get dirty and fuel mileage crashes and things run badly... but not dying on the road bad at just 30K miles. Just to wrap this up... Do you have children? Where I live, losing power at rush hour would result in a wreck at the very least... and deaths are all too common on our crowded roads. Can you imagine, for a moment, you have a teenage daughter driving your Edge, full of her friends, home from an away football game very late on Friday night? Or that same daughter desperately injured in an accident in your home and being rushed to the hospital? We depend, way too much in my opinion, on our cars to be ready at any moment. Yes, bad people do sloppy or no maintenance and they have no one but themselves to blame for a car failing on them. I'll give you that Six Sigma is a goal seldom reached and would still result in some small number of such failures... humans are not perfect so nothing they build will be. Someone who is following all the sane and normal procedures to have a safe and reliable car, including informing Ford, should NOT be left stranded on the side of the road by a widely known flaw. Just doesn't make sense. Someone has or will die because of this. Because it hasn't made the news in our town, doesn't mean it hasn't already happened. Just some thoughts to consider...

OK... sent a note to verify with TRS. For my 2013 Edge Limited with HIR2 they recommended: Ballasts - 3Five (35w) Kelvin - 4300 for "factory" look and 5000 for slightly whiter "cooler" look Wire Harness - 9012 CanBus Can anyone verify/comment on that config? Sounds like they are concerned about "bulb out" warnings if use standard 9006 relay on this car as opposed to CanBus. Ready to order and enjoy... just looking for a few votes on final config. Thanks

Demand that they replace your TB with the "new improved" version. I found out there has been a nation-wide backorder since spring... because they will ALL fail eventually. Hopefully the BO is clearing out. But that tells you that it is a problem for ALL the engines. I will absolutely demand mine be replaced under warranty... just waiting a bit to make sure they can actually get one when I do. I'm thinking spring cause I have time left on the warranty. This is a REALLY SAD thing for Ford to pull right when they are kicking butt in the marketplace. Sigh...

OK... I had a chat with the Service Manager at a local Ford dealer. He swears... and he sounded sincere... that there is a FLAW in the TB design. That Ford has fixed it. BUT... there are nowhere near enough of them available. "A nationwide back order status." according to him. That, when they catch up, there will likely be a Service Bulletin for this issue. He still thinks that cleaning it at 15-20k miles will avoid a failure until they can replace them. So, I'm keeping an eye out for this. Still surprised there's no real info anywhere on the interweb. Definitely going to DEMAND a new one before my warranty expires. This, to me, seems like it justifies a RECALL not just a TSB.

OK! Waldo, that's the type of info I was looking for!! I assume you have the Service Manual? Where can I get one? And, most importantly, I would like to have the part on the TB that I can copy/paste into an e-mail to my "great" dealership service manager. I had a feeling what they were telling me was WRONG! THANKS!!!