mjonis

 

You're reading it wrong. That's an add-on that plugs into the obd-II port. The factory installed version is completely different.

But my reply was specifically in regards to waldo's post that:

"Of course there's logic. To have Ford Connect you need a modem. To put in a modem you need wiring and software"

That's why I replied:

"Not sure about the needing wires for a modem part"

Plugging in an ODB module to get a modem doesn't need new wiring. How am I reading that wrong that the plug in module adds a modem?

"Ford SmartLink plugs into a car's OBDII port, hidden under the dashboard, and contains a GPS chip and 4G/LTE modem."

I never said it was the same, you're putting words in my mouth.

So, had this issue on my Pioneer AVH 4000 NEX head unit, have it also on my Hyundai SFS with Carplay, so I'm pretty sure it's a Carplay/iHeart radio issue, but need more data points. I had a previous issue that iHeart Radio eventually duped and mostly fixed. iPhone 6s with latest public release of iOS (no beta).

1) Make sure your iHeart Radio app is not running on the iPhone (need to double tape the home key to pull up the list of apps "running" and nuke iHeart Radio if running)

2) Plug in iPhone to car. Carplay screen should show up on iPhone and a few seconds later, the iPhone should "lock" (go blank on you).

3) Now, use touch screen or Carplay (speak to siri) to: Play iHeart Radio

What happens on my iPhone (both with Pioneer head unit and new vehicle), probably 90% of the time:

Carplay spins around and then says it can't connect to iHeart Radio. Try again "button" on touchscreen (head unit) is there. Try again like 3 times, still no go.

What does seem to work:

1) While it's spinning "connecting" to iHeart radio, unlock the iPhone screen, then all of a sudden you'll see iHeart radio launch on iPhone.

or

2) Back out to the main Carplay menu on head unit and go *back* into iHeart Radio, then it'll finally load.

All other apps work fine (don't have this issue).

Also had an issue (iHeart Radio duped it) where if you were using iHeart Radio and then went out to radio/XM/whatever on head unit, that 3 minutes later it would switch back to iHeart Radio (very annoying). Took 'em about 3 months and like 7 updates to finally mostly resolve it (happens rarely now).

Of course there's logic. To have Ford Connect you need a modem. To put in a modem you need wiring and software. When you're an OEM you can't just slap that stuff in, you need to design it, test it, coordinate it with production and so on. To do all that work for just a modem is very inefficient, so Ford waits until they are already designing, testing and changing something else at the same time.

 

The 2017 Escape had all new wiring, the 2017 Edge had nothing different than the 2016.

Not sure about the needing wires for a modem part, unless I'm reading this article wrong:

Thought this was interesting:

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/ford-smartlink-gives-older-cars-remote-start-other-connected-features/

Probably more accurate to say Android has challenges with sync. They all use the same Bluetooth standard so if Apple works and Android doesn't blame Android.

Not so in reagrds to the same BT standard. Android (Unless Google has recently changed this) does not support all the bluetooth profiles like Apple does. One of the reasons on a Pioneer Head unit (for example) that bluetooth only (vs. USB/Carplay/AppRadio connection) on iOS can utilize playlists, etc. whereas Android cannot.

Further complicate this by Samsung's BT implementation that (at least on Galaxy S4/S5) had known issues with various things.

Although I would say in Ford's defense that it's more difficult outside of Android Auto to ensure compatibility as there's many diff. versions of the OS, then you have the phone vendor and/or Phone provider that further tweak things so it makes it a bit difficult sometimes. Apple, being a closed ecosystem is *usually* easier to deal with in that regard, IMO.

IF it makes you feel any better, the Kia Sorento and Hyundai Santa Fe vista roofs also making noises due to the heating/cooling contraction/expansion of the various parts. Although I've not seen any reports from Kia/Hyundai forums about loose sheet metal, etc. like on the Ford. Nor have I seen any issues with the Hyundai Santa Fe Sport vista roofs getting stuck (2016 Kia Sorento, yes, but not on the Santa Fe Sport).

I am looking at a new 2017 Ford Edge Sport that has a MSRP of 44,640.00. I was offered 5,000 off or 39,640.00. This includes all current incentives. Is this a good price or could I do better?

IMO, look at Truecar pricing for your area with that EXACT config. If you're under or close to the "lowest" price paid, I personally consider that a good deal. Or you could come to the albany, NY area and pay full MSRP as nobody will deal with you.

When I did my test drives, the A-pillar visibility was pretty bad, IMO. Especially in the parking garage where I have to park my car. Going "down" the parking levels, the A-pillar on the passenger side was pretty bad. Basically by the time you pulled out to see if someone was coming up, it would be too late.

Only options at that point:

a) when turning "right" to go down the levels, you would have to get all the way into the "oncoming" lane in order to get enough visibility (but then again if someone is coming up, now you're literally head on with them)

Slow to a complete stop and inch forward

to be fair, my old Chevy had *almost* (but not quite) as bad visibility.

The Hyundai has (IMO) marginally (not a lot) better visibility. Sorento just as bad.

Yes, the little window would've helped, IMO, but last time I saw one of those was on my sister's Lexus.

I understand it's for crashes and stuff, but it's a bit annoying. Fortunately I just inch forward and piss off the people behind me in the garage as apparently everyone is in a hurry (both coming in and going out apparently).

Although with the Hyundai, the surroundview camera can help a little, but obviously you have to be looking at it and not the "road". Not sure if the 180 degree front-view camera could help in that situation on the Ford.

Does the Hyundai product feel substantial or creaky? How is the road noise? This has been a very serious problem in the past for them. What about the quality of the materials inside? This has been a problem for them as well, interiors didn't hold up. I am also looking at the 2017 gmc acadia. Because it has 42 cu ft. In the cargo area.

Sorry for the delay. I haven't had any creaking/noises, although in all the vehicles I test drove, if you opened the power shade (but left the sunroof closed), and there was a strong wind, you could hear the vinyl rails creak a little or hear them as the sun heated things up.

The top-end Santa Fe Sport has a lot of nice leather, although the dash is some softer plastic, but the "grooving" can make it interesting to clean, although some 303 sprayed on a microfiber cloth (vs. spraying on the dash) works quite well. My roomate's 2014 SFS still is quiet and no creaking/noises. I will admit the Edge had nicer seats and a well-designed interior. Again, if the dealers in my area had been willing to deal, I would've taken the Ford, but I couldn't justify an $11-12k price differential.

After a few months now I will say that the road noise is probably the biggest deficiency (but I knew this going on) on the Hyundai. But I could spend $2k on some professionally installed sound dampening and get something as quiet as the Ford in that case (well except for the acoustic glass). Again, about a 4db difference between the two.

Those are the dealers you stay away. Those are the dealers that make all the good Ford dealers like the one I buy all my cars from unfairly look bad. It must be a New York thing because I was on a Subaru forum where a lot of them played that same game. When custom ordering a non limited production car, you should never pay more than invoice at most. I am sad, but glad that you at least rewarded a dealer that appreciates the privilidge of having customers interested in their product. If you would not have minded flying in and driving 9 hours back home, the dealer I exclusively buy from would have made it worth your while if you tell them I sent you.

Thanks! Maybe in a few years I might change my mind or something. Shoot me a PM with the dealer name.

Ironically the two dealers (not the "we dont' play sticker games" one) called me back to see what decision I'd made.

Dealer #1 (Latham Ford):

I said, the best offer you gave me was like $41,635 WITH trade-in and I'd still have to spend $2,000 for the warranty, remote start, and parts to fix the seat backs. That's almost $14,000 more than my offer from Hyundai. (both offers didn't include tax, title, registration)

"yeah, but it's not apples to apples".

Me: You're right. The Ford is nicer, but not $14.5k nicer, IMO.

I told them Orange Motors offer was $39,500 with trade-in but still the $2,000 more so total was like $41,500. I said that was the best offer I received.

Dealer #2 - Orange Motors

The guy really did try somewhat. Best price offer with a Factory Order and 10 week wait time (plus no guarantee they'd have the 0% for 72 months) was $39,500 plus the $2,000. So $41,500. Only $11,500 more than the Hyundai.

Oh well, lessons learned. If you want top trim, and nobody stocks it, expect to pay MSRP and then they'll do the tradein.

I even told both dealers I would've gone up to $35,500 (maybe $36k) with everything (if they had included the warranty and the smart phone remote start parts, I would've done the deal).

But enjoying my new car now. I did tell dealer #2 if a used one shows up in the lot in 3 years (unlikely) to give me a ring.

I rented a SantaFe (limited, mind you) this summer for a 6000 km trek and was very impressed. I found a few features on the Hyundai that were missing on my Edge (actually working cooled seats), but overall I wouldn't trade my Edge for a Hyundai. Personal criteria are by nature subjective and at the end of the day, what counts, is your personal feeling, regardless of technical features. As an example, we were looking for a replacement vehicle for my wife . I thought the Escape was the One, did what you did, calculating and weighting, but my wife said "I don't feel good in this car" and we went for a Tucson.

 

So good choice!

Amen! Yes, for *me* it's good.

I have no regerts (that commercial).

I will say I envy those of you that the Edge though. It's a VERY nice car. Just wish the dealers would've had stock and could've played "lets make a deal".

THANK YOU ALL for answering all my questions. This is the best Edge forum out there!!!!

Well, it is done.

Unfortunately, while I liked the Ford the best, I could not justify spending almost $10k more vs. my #2 - the Hyundai Santa Fe Sport.

I was willing to go up to even $4500 more, but because it's end of year, a nationwide search on Ford's dealer locator (the guy showed me) only yielded ONE Ford Edge Titanium, AWD, 2.0 L Ecboost, with 302A, Driver's Pkg, and Cold weather pkg. One in the "area". All the others were out of state (like Arizona and elsewhere). Because of that, the dealers have little room to deal. The "best" deal was 40k which included $4500 for my trade-in. But that still left me having to spend about $800 for extended warranty, another $350 for parts to fix the seat cooling issue, and another $500 or so for the remote start. At that point, the "total price" would've been about $41,750. Before tax, title, registration. Hyundai before tax, title registration: 30k.

On the plus side, I got my Hyundai seat issue fixed. Apparently I did not realize that I sit very close to my steering wheel in my own car (because it doesn't have telescoping steering wheel). As such, I was sitting with the Hyundai steering wheel "out" too far, which made my legs stretch. I pushed the steering wheel in further and then I could move the seat up more and raise my legs. And the AC issue must've either been the model I test drove (it was still in plastic), but the model I bought (I did test drive today) worked fine.

So I am a happy camper. If money was no object, I would've taken the Ford, but in my old age, I look at things a little more practically now.

Thank you ALL for answering all my questions. The Ford is a fine vehicle, even if it's missing a lot of features of my Hyundai (and to be true, Hyundai's missing some features of the Ford).

Who knows, maybe in 3 years I sell mine and buy a used 2016 Edge.

AZ is far to go for a dealer trade. The Edge is made very close to you in Canada. You could do a custom order from the factory if you can wait 6 or so weeks. The financing offer may or may not still be there although the auto industry is appearing to head into a recession.

Yeah, they said they could still factory order, but it would only be $600 cheaper.

Well unfortunately the only dealer WITH what I wanted (and it's been on the dealer's website for quite some time) doesn't do "sticker games". It's MSRP minus whatever factory rebates there are.

Rats none of the Ford dealers have what I want. The best they can do is order from Arizona and sell it to me at MSRP. The best deal I got was $40k with trade in which is basically $4500 for trade in and a little less. Poop. That's like almost $83.5k more than the Hyundai. My only option is to take a color I'm not thrilled with and 20" tires. I wonder how easy it is to switch the tires out?

Something like the Kia DRL thing sounds like a simple software parameter that is shut off in the US. If you search DRL software turn on, I'm sure that could be enabled.

 

Don't know why car makers ship vehicles that have this capability with the feature disabled, but they do.

 

Chances are if something like that , that is standard elsewhere, is able to be turned on here.

Yeah, but not sure if the Canadian Kia DRL is actually the same light assembly, or if there's an additional row of lights. I will say it made a big difference for me. I'm used to my Chevy DRL "auto" lights, so I can pull into the parking garage or my own garage and actually be able to see something while the vehicle takes its sweet ass time switching to full headlights. On the Kia you get no lighting for about 30-45 seconds while it detects a low-light condition and turns on the headlights.

Since I really like the Surround View camera on the Hyundai/Kia/Nissan (or anyone else that has it):

Can you enable the front 180 degree camera and the rear camera at the same time on the Ford?

If not, can you enable the front camera whenever you want?

On a 2011 you should have the option to disable autolock in the vehicle settings menu.

 

On the horn you have 3 options:

 

Turn off the engine.

Leave the keyfob in the vehicle.

Don't close the door all the way.

OMG the honk is SO annoying. I just noticed that yesterday on my test drive. The Hyundai has an electronic "beeeeeeeeeeeep" that'll get your attention but not as loud as the double honk.

But I do like the disabling of the honk. Leaving the door open isn't really an option in the middle of a snowstorm while you're out shoveling snow off your car and you don't want it getting through the door crack or building up so when you open the door it all falls on your nice leather door stuff.

They really could've made it a beep. But then again they could've put AEB in the 2016 or at the least, the 2017.

Without quoting myself (ha!), I slightly miscalculated. This actually works in Ford's favor I think.

The Hyundai offer was a large chunk of rebates, that could not be combined with special financing. I ran the numbers (to see which was better, full rebates, and regular financing, or partial rebates and special financing) and I realized:

I FORGOT to calculate the TOTAL price including interest.

Ford has 0% APR, and the dealer can probably get me the $1,000 cash back.

Anyway, I think Ford may have a shot, but it also gives me ammo to the Hyundai "offer" because of the pricing difference with the interest.

I think I win either way, but I'm now kinda hoping that Ford pulls through.

OK, took a few early test drives today, but still going to the Ford place tomorrow.

Everything's been calculated and measured, etc.

If I go solely on my scoring (I did modify a few things like the weighting because it didn't make sense to have some "nice to have" items with "4" for a weighting when the must have also had 4's):

Ford comes in #1 at a score of 2,010

Hyundai next at a score of 1,971

and Kia last at a score of 1,943

Overall, I could be "happy" with any one of the 3. I think the Ford would be "happier" (not counting scores, just overall "gut" feel). I'd put Kia last as well by "gut".

Biggest cons for Ford:

Extra cost for warranty (about $800)

Extra cost to have seats that actually cool (I think it's $340 for the 2-seat kit)--plus the time to install it

Extra cost for smartphone remote start (I think around $350 as well)

Biggest Cons for Hyundai:

Ride was not quite as quiet (only 4-5 db on average, however)

Front seat thigh support seems a bit stiff, but I am going to futz with the seat some more, but WAY better than the 2014.

AC and seat cooling isn't as "cool" as the Ford (for AC) or Kia (for both). But at least the seats DO cool. I had all 3 vehicles at the lowest fan speed and the Ford and Kia froze my ass off (well fingers actually).

Biggest Cons for Kia:

Headrests are NOT adjustable (Kia's website and manual lie). It was extremely uncomfortable to drive/sit with my head tilted forward. I either had to recline the seat to the point my arms were stretched out or suffer. (BTW similar complaints on the Kia forums about this). Only "solution" *may* be to buy the 2016 headrests and swap them out.

Interior Console is just ugh (highly subjective/personal) compared to the other two. Steering wheel controls are just atrocious. TWO sets on each side of "roller" bars, plus buttons. It's not a "bad" car, but even the 15 minute trip to work I had a headache from the damn headrest. No auto-DRL is sucky too. I pulled into the garage and you can't see crap. You have to wait like 30-45 seconds for the stupid sensor to detect the "dark" to switch on the headlights.

All vehicles had the same ride quality (or perceived by the g-force meter in terms of bumps moving the car). They all felt different (don't know how else to describe it). I thought they all had "bumps" that were perceived, just differently. Given the above, I'm ruling the Kia out. It is in NO way worth the extra $8k price difference, IMO, especially given that it scored lower than the Ford, and the Ford is $5500 (MSRP) price difference. Based on MSRP of course. Heck even if they discounted it 10% and got it down to 40k, and Ford only down to 42k, I'd still take the Ford over the Kia.

Now the question:

The Hyundai dealer gave me an offer (nothing's signed, no credit report, I can sense he's kinda hungry so maybe I can squeez some more== it's just an offer) for almost 15% below MSRP. And what I "wanted" on Trade-in. This comes in below Truecar, and *my* acceptable # of 10% (you'll notice when I did the spreadsheet I assumed a 10% discount). I feel it's a fair offer. It's in my #2 color choice. Only one other dealer in the area has one (meaning no others in any color with the config I want in the area). Granted, could probably order one. I could use this as leverage, I dunno, but we'll see.

So, is the Ford "worth" almost $10,500 more (compared to the current Hyundai offer, excluding trade-in), given the extra costs involved?

I don't think so. But that's personal opinion. I don't think it's even worth $7k more.

However, to clear my conscience, I emailed the Internet Sales guy (whom I've already met twice and am seeing tomorrow as part of my meeting) basically saying:

Here's the config I want, here's my list of color choices (exterior) and interior (in order of preference)

I want $X for the trade-in (same as what Hyundai would give me)

I want 10-year PSP PremiumCare at no additional charge

I want the smartphone remote start at no additional charge

and I will offer $34,000 before tax/title/registration

I highly doubt they'll take it, but I personally don't think they will. That's $3500 more than the Hyundai (before tax/title/registration) which is what I think a slightly quieter ride and better infotainment system is worth.

So I think that's where things stand at this point.

Remember that there is a reason why the Korean cars need to be so heavily discounted. The market has judged that the Edge is better and thus supply meets demand at a higher price point.

Well, not sure that's true any longer. Consumer reports rated the Kia Sorento 2016 the #1 "mid-size" SUV (I think that's the category). I believe the Ford was #7 or #8 on that list?

http://www.consumerreports.org/car-reliability/most-and-least-reliable-cars-by-class/?loginMethod=auto

(although the above is only for one year instead of 3, so I take that with a grain of salt)

http://www.consumerreports.org/cars/best-cars-top-picks-2016/

Also, JDPower's reliability rating for 2016 (based upon the previous 3 years) has Ford #31 out of 32. Only Dodge had more repairs/100 cars or something. Kia and Hyundai were like #7 and #8.

http://www.jdpower.com/press-releases/2016-us-vehicle-dependability-study-vds

That being said, we'll see which one comes out on top, and then deal with pricing. If #1 can't get me my price, then I'll just go to choice #2.

If Ford is chosen, they're going to have to go below invoice, especially factoring that an "equivalent" warranty is going to cost around $800, plus the $360 for the 3rd party seat cooling fix issue.

But we'll see.

Damn! Some people are total buttholes. I hope they find the bastard and nail their ass to the ground. That looked pretty serious, IMO.

If you are looking for as new as a 2015, have you considered buying a new 2016? There are really good deals along with 0% financing for up to 6 years. Not paying interest really raises your car buying ability for a budget. The new Edge is really refined and behaves more like an entry level luxury car.

Plus the 2015 Edge was the first year of the re-design and, IMO, should be avoided due to water issues (yes, they were eventually fixed, but there's no guarantee that EVERY vehicle still being sold isn't one of the suspect units until it pees all over itself on the inside and then you know), tailight condensation. And no Sync 3.

If you're looking for earlier years, check consumer reports and carcomplaints.com. I forget which year (2013?) but one of the Edge years was a total dog, IMO. Compared to others.

I'm fine with any comments on the spreadsheet if anyone has anything. My roomate suggested I change some of the weightings because it didn't make much sense to give my "must haves" a 4 or a 5 for a weighting and then give some of the "nice to have" a 4 weighting as well. That would imply they weight the same, which would imply that it's "equal", and in my mind, a "must have" is more important than a "nice to have".

Also warranty should be considered. Not sure if I'll leave that as a deciding factor or not. Obviously Kia/Hyundai have same 10-year warranty. If it comes to that (warranty between Ford and the others) I'll see if the dealer would throw in the 10-year warranty at no charge, and if not, then it gets dinged.

Looking at the pictures, I'm really dis-liking the interior steering wheel controls/console of the Kia more and more, but we'll see once I actually drive it. I look at the interior of my car now and think it's hideous, but at the time, it wasn't too bad (haha)--at least compared to the Toyota Highlander I test drove back in 2005.

From what I can tell, Ford is less likely to deal as compared to Kia/Hyundai, at least based upon Truecar sales. It seems a very good chance to get a 10-12% discount off MSRP vs. Ford at like 4%.

We shall see.

Thanks. It's just nice in the bitter cold winter (or if it's snowing) to be able to keep the doors shut, heat on, and go brush snow off without the damn horn honking as you get to the front or rear of the car. I'll just have to leave the keys in the car when I get out I suppose.

Interesting, will have to definitely try this on my test drive.

Check that axlegeek, you can use to compare many specs between many cars. Such as hp, mpg, space, etc.

Will check it out, but they don't seem too accurate so far. They're stating that some vehicles like the 2017 Kia Sportage SX Turbo doesn't have heated front seats, when it's a standard feature.