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bb56

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  1. oops! I see my error. I was trying to track down all that has gone on with your brakes to make sure we didn't miss anything. Good luck Dean
  2. Hi Dean, I'm out of ideas here. I remember the backing up and hard stops 'seemed' to firm them up but it really didn't help me either. If all wheels were hot with shiny rotors after riding the brakes, then they appear to be working - just poorly , right? As far as I can tell, your brakes were fine but making noise in December '19 but you said you needed calipers and pads. Did that happen? Did the brakes feel good afterwards? What about February (2020 I assume) when they said it was ABS related and you need a tone ring? I would invest in getting Forscan running and look at all the codes that may be in the ABS system. A Tone Ring would make noise if it came loose (there is a thread on this forum about someone fixing theirs and the noise it makes.) Even though I use Forscan, and no codes were set, I found a road with dirt edges and got my ABS to kick in so that I knew it was working with no codes. I can't say for sure that I managed to get the rear ABS going though. I would manually check the Tone rings by tapping each one lightly with a screwdriver to see if they are tight on the drive shaft. All that said, I don't know how it makes the pedal low unless the HCU is fouled with air and it's not kicking in or stuck in an open position somehow but I'm getting out of my depth quickly here. When my caliper was bad, the brake pedal would go close enough to the floor that my other foot could not fit under the pedal. Needless to say I was driving very defensively. If I think of something else, i'll post. If you find a good local garage, or even a brake shop, maybe they can diagnose it for you. The dealer had their chance. But check forscan for ABS codes. If you fix it, let us know what did it.
  3. Hey Dean, I feel your pain because this should be straightforward - right? I was frustrated on how long it took me to fix it. To answer your question - how to confirm the rear are not engaging - a few thoughts come to mind: 1) Are the rotors shiny/clean? if so, they are likely getting at least some pad contact. 2) Try riding the brakes (foot on the brakes while driving forward) for a quarter mile or so and see if the rear wheels feel as hot as the front. Even better if you have an Infrared contact-less thermometer. My daughter had a sticking brake pad and she came home complaining it was grinding loudly. I got my thermometer and aimed it through the wheel openings at the rotor and caliper. It was 200 deg F while the others were 90 deg F. So this may give you an easy way to tell. Harbor freight had them for cheap when I got mine and I use it for many things. I suspect if they aren't working right the temp will be noticeably cooler than the fronts. (for the record, she never uses her parking brake and the calipers did not adjust causing a lot of play in the piston-to-pad opening, which in turn, caused the pad to tilt and bind) 3) Not sure if you regard the "e brake" as Emergency Brake or Electronic parking brake. The Emergency brake to me is also the manual parking brake using the left most pedal under the dash. If you don't use it, the rear brakes don't adjust properly, if at all. If you have electronic parking brake, there is a button someplace to set it on. or off. All that said, can you drive with the parking brake set easily or do you feel them trying to hold the car still. Mine will let me go forward (because I forget to release it (LOL) but the dash will ding-ding me until I do. The fact is I can move the car fairly easily by stepping on the gas, but it holds the car on a hill in neutral. One of the things I did to try to get my bad caliper to adjust was to go back and forth alternately pushing on the brakes then the parking brake. I must have done it 20 times but mine didn't change - the caliper was simply broken. My 2011 has the manual parking brake. When I applied it, I could see that the cable at the top of the caliper pulled the lever on the caliper toward the front of the car which causes the piston to push against the pads. Even though my caliper was bad, my problem was that the piston should stay close to the pad even after releasing the parking brake. Mine didn't - it went all the way back in. It doesn't sound like this is your problem though, but if you remove the caliper, is it nice and tight to the rotor or does it come off easily? It should be a little stiff if it is adjusting correctly. ** IMPORTANT ** this just occurred to me: When you put your new pads on a while back, how did you get the rear pistons back into the calipers? There is a special procedure to rotate it back (like screwing it in.) BUT: when you do, you have to align the pin on the brake pad to the slot on the piston! Check out MacBWT's video here to see what I mean. If the pin on the pad is not in the slot on the piston, you will lose a lot of braking power in the rear and the parking brake may never adjust it properly. You may want to double check this. Hope this helps. BB56 (Bart)
  4. I wish I knew more about the e brake Dean but I've not seen one. Can someone else jump in here? If the rear brake caliper pistons are traveling because they are not adjusting, they'll gobble up a lot of the fluid from the Master cylinder. One thing I remember is that if I very quickly double pumped the brake pedal, it would be higher the second time - meaning additional fluid from the reservoir was pushed to the brake caliper before it pushed it back after releasing the pedal from the first push. As a troubleshooting step, I would try several times to quickly double pump during a hard stop (remember to check behind you...LOL) to see if the pedal behaves better on the second push. If it seems to grab higher, then something is using up the fluid from the first push. I had to do it several times and if I was real quick the pedal was much better. If you have someone who can push the brake pedal while the car is up on a jack stand, you could look at the rear caliper after removing the tire. See if the first push is moving the caliper piston (the inner pads are pushed by the piston, the outer pads are held in place by the caliper.) Movement is very slight. The whole caliper slides on the two pins that must be greased and move freely as the piston squeezes the inner pad, rotor, and outer pad together. If either the inner pad or the outer pad is sticking, they could be flexing which would consume more fluid. In general, after my neighbor pointed that out, I took the whole caliper off to check its operation and found the piston fully retracted into the caliper. My pads were slightly worn thus giving the piston too much room to travel. So you can pull the caliper, clean the pad mounting surfaces and use brake grease to lube them slightly, make sure the two slide bolts move freely and have plenty of grease under the boots. I'm not a know-it-all, but I am reflecting on why it took me so darn long to figure out a soft brake pedal condition where my pedal was close to the floor but still stopping the car. I think the front brakes were doing all the work. I bled them and found no real difference. I knew the booster was good (no noises and it would pull the brake pedal down when I started the car with my foot on it.) So I bit the bullet and replaced the master cylinder which was a waste of time and money, but thought it was not bled properly again. And finally someone pointed me to inspect the calipers and pads closely. I already checked that the pads were still pretty thick, but went back again as suggested and there it was. To me, brakes should be child's play, but I did not pay attention to details and I suffered time and money for it. If you're still uncertain, maybe try putting new pads in the rear. The thicker material may improve the pedal and then you know something is up in those calipers. Hope this helps because it drove me crazy until I replaced the caliper ($90 at NAPA for Motorcraft replacement.) Good luck! Bart
  5. hey Dean, How does the parking brake feel? Will it hold the car still while in gear? If the parking brake is not adjusted properly, it will not adjust the rear caliper pistons. It could be possible that the rear brakes are not adjusting. When the parking brake is applied, the cable should be very tight at each rear wheel. I've seen where the cable and it's shield get water in them and rust to the point where they can't move. Maybe you want to check for proper operation of the parking brake system.
  6. @1004ronThis problem isn't limited to 2015 and up. My 2011 had the same fluttering air shields because the pins were loose and rattling in their holes. On inspection, the fender well pins exhibited the same behavior. So when an Amazon package arrived for me with hi-density-poly foam panels, I sliced off 1/4" pieces and made 1"x1" square washers. I popped each of the plastic rivets with one of the body tools that removes them, put the newly minted washers on them and popped them back in. Luckily it was black foam. No more noises! It took me only 2 years to find where the noise was coming from-LOL. It's apparent that the new fastening system will not lend itself to my fix, but you might think about winding hi-density foam strips around the string (like a twist tie) before winding the string around the new fastener. It will probably last longer. The foam is pretty robust and stiff. Mine's been fine for nearly 2 years now. Good luck!
  7. It might make sense to check out all the things that could have been damaged by the broken ball joint mishap. If the wheel went under the car or ended up turning violently right or left, it could have damaged the half shaft, the steering rack, tie rod (inner or outer), etc. I would go back into diagnosis mode and try to figure out possible causes. It is possible that the lower control arm is faulty or not torqued in properly. The metal on metal grinding noise occurs only when the car is in motion so could the hub have been damaged? Is the wheel on tight? Try jacking it up from under the control arm enough to get a crowbar under the tire and try to lever the wheel up/down to see if/what is making noise. Maybe the brake backing plate is bent? Tell us more about exactly what your doing when the noise occurs (driving straight, straight but over bumps, turning, turning with bumps, turning left/right, etc. Maybe someone will think of something. If you're still stuck, take it to a front end shop. Good luck.
  8. Are you getting any codes? Could be as simple as the sensor has moved or has rust/corrosion between it and the tone ring. Look at them from the back side of the brake plate where the axle goes through the hub. I had a similar with my old explorer where the ring was dirty/crusty and I cleaned it and wiped off the sensor. All was good. There is another post on this forum that talks about a "cracked tone ring" that slips making the abs system think the wheel is sliding instead of rolling. The tone ring should be solidly on the half shaft. Try tapping it lightly with the back end of a screwdriver to see if it's loose. If it is, check out the solution found under Tone Ring Repair on this forum.
  9. I just installed KYB's in the rear of my 2011 AWD Limited. I have the power liftgate so there were some extra steps involved than in this video. A few things I learned: 1. The liftgate motor can be removed without disconnecting the battery. The service manual says to remove fuse 9 in the fusebox under the left dash. After doing that, I could disconnect it safely. The service manual says that it needs to be calibrated after reassembly. (My lift struts were in great shape so it was rock solid open without the motor attached.) 2. I only needed to remove the rear most plastic body pin holding the side panel to the floor. The shock mount is pretty close to the rear so you don't have to move the side panels out much. 3. I really need a 1/2" ratchet. The video says a 24 mm and 22 mm sockets are needed, but my 15/16" and 13/16" box end wrenches fit perfectly and that's all I had that would fit. The bottom bolts have a lot of thread lock on them so every turn requires a lot of force. I didn't need to use heat or anything. The bolt/nut is situated so I could use my foot and stand on the end of the wrench (about a foot long which gives me approx 160 ft lbs) and they moved enough to start the laborious process of step - move the wrench one flat, step again, etc. The bolt had a wrench that jammed against the floor so this worked well. 4. The KYB's came with this ridiculous instruction sheet full of pictograms. I've done shocks many times, but you may as well have given me an emoji dictionary. None of it made sense. One area of confusion was the upper thrust washers were different sizes - one slightly larger than the other. I have no idea which way they need to go (larger one, then rubber grommet, then thru the body, then rubber grommet, then smaller one, then the bigger nut. I hope that's right.) 5. Torquing the upper one by myself was impossible. The upper shell underneath would turn, so I used my 1/4" impact in one hand and held the shell with the other until it would not go anymore. The lock nut was easy with two wrenches. The first shock took me 2 hours with the manual wrenching and initial tear down of the interior and lift motor. The second one took an hour with the manual wrenching then the reassembly of the interior. The final step was to initialize the liftgate motor. I closed the rear hatch manually like the service manual said. Replacing fuse 9 was no picnic. It is directly in line with the hood release cable so the little fuse puller would not go in straight. I fiddled with it for about 10 minutes before I used a 3" section of 1/4" dowel with a channel cut in the end to fit the minifuse. It fir snug so it was in in 2 minutes. At that point, I hit the dash button and the hatch opened, then dropped down a few inches. Pushed the button again and it closed properly, the next push opened perfectly. I need some better sockets and wrenches if I'm going to continue this level maintenance on my Edge. It just turned 100K miles and rides like a dream.
  10. Hi All, With all due respect to Macbwt's videos, I think this is the most straightforward video tutorial on how to do this job. It's short and to the point and does not leave anything out (except, of course, the banging/heating/swearing and surprises of the big rusted nuts and bolts below.) It gives a good look at the steps needed and if you're lucky enough to have the right tools, it sets reasonable expectations that it can be accomplished in a relatively short time. I'll be doing it this week after I borrow a breaker bar and sockets for the big bolt. He makes the upper bolts and panel preparation look simple. Wish me luck! After seeing it, I thought it would be good to share if you haven't seen it.
  11. Will be interested to hear what fixed it.
  12. When this happened to me, the rear brake caliper was bad. The rear has automatic adjustment everytime you use the park brake. My caliper would no longer ratchet to close the gap between the piston and the inner brake pad. When my neighbor suggested a bend or stuck pad, I examined them more closely and saw a 1/16" or larger gap between the pad and the piston. Nothing I did would adjust the caliper piston so I replaced the caliper, bled the brakes and voila! Normal brakes again. Check pad clearance on the rear inner pads, and make sure the caliper closes rock solid when someone steps on the brake. My park brake worked ok but not great so that was another clue. A third clue was that the rear disk surfaces were not clean, meaning the brakes were not closing tightly on the disk. Hope it helps!
  13. Slamming on the brakes may have caused a brake pad to stick or the caliper fail with enough space between the caliper piston and the pad to accept a lot of fluid. I had a caliper fail where the ratchet adjustment mechanism would not work and keep the gap very small. The result was soft and squishy brakes! if you examine the calipers in the rear, see if the inner pads have any clearance to the piston. If so, check that out first. When my booster failed, the pedal would sink very low and lose the power assist so I had to push hard and actually pump the brake pedal. The booster also made a noise like an air (vacuum, really) leak when I pressed the pedal.
  14. So even a 4WD will stay still wile spinning the wheel with only one wheel off the ground? Seems counter-intuitive. I was thinking I need to raise at least one front and one back wheel off the ground to get the car to sit there while spinning its wheels. Even then, I'm not so sure. Has anyone done this successfully?
  15. @mikeyhd I'm facing the same issue on my 2011 AWD but still trying to isolate which wheel. From my research, it seems there is conflicting evidence as to which type of front bearings are in the car. There are fully assembled hub and bearings that claim to fit the front of my 2011 but also claim to fit the rear. Those are bolt-on replacements that only fit my rear wheels. My 2011 has the front bearing seated in the knuckle casting. Removing the hub from the bearing will likely break the old bearing. I've seen many shops and DIYers simply replace the hub with a new one. It may be a wise choice to have one on hand if you damage the old one removing the broken race that sticks to the hub. The hub could also be corroded and make life difficult. The bearing on my 2011 needs to be pressed out of the knuckle after removing the retainer circlip after the hub is removed. So if you've inspected your front wheels, if the 2013's don't have 4 bolts holding the hub and bearing in, then you'll need the separate bearing, circlip and hub to be sure to avoid problems. A bearing puller kit with appropriate sized billets and receiver cups will make life easier and I've seen videos where it is done without removing the entire knuckle from the car if you have the kit. I've decided to only order Timken bearings. There have been a few comparisons to Moog (usually very good) and other "knockoff" brands that are inferior and this is a job that I want to last. I saw the bearing for $35 at Carid.com and Amazon has the hub, bearing and clip for about $72 here   Hope this helps answer your question. I'm going to hope it is a rear bearing on mine...
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