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Hi Mcginnis158. :D This is an often asked question. I took the liberty of copying and pasting a reply from one of the other threads asking the same question. Hope you find the information helpful and informative. Copy and Paste begins now: Anyway, here are just some of the reasons for your "low" MPG's at this time of year. Please read the following list carefully, as there is at least two factors that you can do something about (#5 & #8): Here are just some of the many (simplified) reasons your car will get lower mpg's in very cold weather: 1 - In many regions of the US, the gas formula is switched over by law to an "Oxygenated" mixture in the winter months, to meet EPA Air Pollution standards. This mixture is inherently less fuel efficient. Your car uses more fuel. 2 - An automobile engine has a specific temperature range where it is most fuel and power efficient. Get too far out of that ideal temperature range, either high or low, and fuel efficiency suffers. So essentially, extremely warm or extremely cold temperatures (summer and winter in most regions) adversely effect fuel consumption and engine efficiency. Once you are out of that ideal range, your car use more fuel. 3 - A car will take longer to warm up in cold weather, therefore running richer for longer. Your car uses more fuel. 4 - Cold air is denser than warm air, so an engine needs more fuel to run properly (just to drive normally). Therefore, the Engine Management System must run a richer mixture, to avoid running lean. Your car uses more fuel 5 - If you run your front windshield defroster, or have the Automatic Temperature Control HVAC system set to "Auto", your cars A/C compressor is running to dehumidify the warm air. It is the same as running your A/C in the summer. Your car uses more fuel. 6 - It takes more energy to get a car moving and keep it moving in wet, icy and snowy conditions, than it does in dry conditions. Think of driving in snow as almost the equivalent of driving in sand. Your tires, and therefore your engine, need to overcome more force against them. Your car uses more fuel. 7 - If you read your Owners Manual, or search this site for information, you will see that the 3.5 Liter engine in the Edge will take at least 5,000 miles to be fully broken in. Until that time, you guessed it, your car uses more fuel. 8 - Since you purchased your Edge, have you checked the tire pressure with a good quality tire pressure gauge? Do you own a good quality pressure gauge? You certainly should. Low tire pressure will adversely affect fuel mileage. Tires will lose about 1.5psi for every 10*F drop in ambient temperature. For example, if you last checked your tires in November, when the temperature was 70*, and now it is 20*, your tires will now be at least 7.5psi low. Plus it is dangerous to drive with under-inflated tires. Check them, and fill them to the recommended pressure listed on the door sticker of your Edge (or preferably 2-3psi higher). These are just a few quick, simple reasons. I am sure someone else will jump in with more. And not that it makes us feel any better, but our friends and neighbors are not immune. Their cars are getting lower mpg's also. If they say they are not getting lower mpg's, they are either oblivious or telling a little white lie. You can't beat the laws of physics and chemistry. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Meckwell. :D No, it is not too late, if your Dealer will accept an X-Plan purchase on the vehicle. Plan participation is voluntary for Dealerships (but if they agree to accept, they must follow the Plan rules). Go to the Dealership and let them know you have a friend who just told you that they can provide an X-Plan PIN to you. Ask them if you can switch the deal over to an X-Plan purchase. "Usually", this is not a problem. If the Dealer refuses, as leverage you can always tell them you wish to cancel the deal, and receive a refund on your deposit. Just be sure that the deposit is refundable before you do that. Then you can always purchase on the Plan at another Dealership. However, most Dealers do not seem to have problem with changing deals over to X-Plan qualifying purchases. Let us know how it goes, and good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Mike&Sara. :D What does your Dealer say in response to that question? Well, assuming your Dealer is competent, and assuming there are no Holiday or other plant shut downs (as there just was over the Christmas/New Year Holidays), and averaging the variable of where you live (distance the vehicle needs to be shipped), you can figure on a 6-8 week wait. To help avoid added anxiety, plan on 8 weeks, but hope for 6! :happy feet: Keep in mind that you may be told other (well intentioned) wait times that will not take into account that they were affected by one or more of these extenuating circumstances. Have to add that I agree with your choice, as I always Factory Order my cars (will not buy off the lot, even if they have or can trade for exactly what I want). In this way, not only do you get exactly what you want, no compromises, but you don't need to wonder how long the vehicle has been sitting there being handled and test driven by God knows who. :shades: Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi atomicleda. :D Yes, it is a common problem, and the lighter the color of the leather, the more noticeable it is. It is just a transference of dye residue and contaminants. It will clean up just fine with a good quality leather cleaner and conditioner. I have an MKZ with the Light Stone Interior (a very light gray leather) and have the same problem. My Cougar has a darker gray leather, and it takes longer to notice, but still happens. There is nothing wrong with the leather in your car. You are just seeing a dye transfer from your jeans. It happens with mine when I wear my black jeans, after a few weeks, you can begin to see black discoloration in the "high traffic" areas of the seat. As far as a seat cover, well, that is up to you. I just clean mine periodically (as we all should do with leather anyway). My philosophy is why cover up my good looking leather seats. When they need cleaning, I just clean them. I use "Meguiar's" Gold Class Leather Cleaner and Conditioner. I also use "Tanners Preserve" Leather Cleaner and "Tanners Preserve" Leather Conditioner. Motorcraft's leather care products are good. You can also get good quality leather care products from "Mother's" and "Lexol". There are also other good brand names, but these are the ones I favor. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Edgieguy. :D Okay, let's try to answer your questions one at a time: 1 - No, they can't "make" you pay that etching fee. But, they also do not have to sell/lease you the vehicle. It is a profit packer. Tell them you do not want it. Maybe you can negotiate it off completely, maybe only partially. You can always try to convince them that it is a deal breaker if they don't remove it. 2 - "Documentation Fees" are limited to a $75 maximum. Make them correct that "mistake". 3 - $595 "Acquisition Fee". Yes, unfortunately you are on the hook for that one. Without getting on one of my "this is why you should avoid Leasing if you can, because Leasing costs more" rants, this is just one of the many ways that Dealers make more on a Lease than they do a Sale. There are just so many more ways that a Dealer can hide charges and fees in a Lease, that are not available on a straight Sale. Therefore, Leasing costs more. Right off the bat, you have paid $595 more than a Purchaser. And to jump start the "How great a deal I got", and how they did not have to pay that "Fee" people, we are talking about the facts of this Lease, and Edgieguy does have to pay it. 4 - Tire Disposal Fee. Yes, I live in NJ also, and we do have to pay that fee ($1.50 per tire, 5 tires including the spare) on AXZ-Plan Sales. It is a State mandated, EPA dictated fee. Anyway, hope this information helps, and best of luck with your new Edge! :beerchug:

Hi Kyle. :D I am sorry for your bad luck. At least it was not your fault! In reality, there is no way for any of us to give a definitive answer over the Internet. Of course the safe answer is: If you are concerned and feel your Edge's suspension is damaged and not performing as it should, you should not drive it. There is always the possibility of further damage (even if it is a small possibility). Do you have Insurance coverage, or preferably the name and Policy # of the Company covering the person that hit you? Call them and let them know you need them to provide a loaner car until your car is repaired. They will then either need to provide the rental, or check your car to be sure it is safe if they refuse and say it is drivable. If they say it is drivable, there is your answer. Otherwise, the only other recommendation I can make, if you are not sure how bad the damage is, would be this: Have the friend of yours with the most automotive knowledge take a look at it, or drive it to the nearest service station and have them take a quick look. Get their advice as to whether you can drive it safely or not. Having said all that, you probably can drive it, but when in doubt, play it safe. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi tiaquessa. :D Lease pricing is not my area of expertise, so I cannot really comment on your deal. However, I wanted to reply for two reasons: First, to let you know that we are seeing your post, and hopefully someone with leasing expertise will jump in soon. Second, because you say that the price includes "Sales and Property Taxes". Is that just a typo? Why would you be paying "Property Taxes" on a vehicle purchase? I am in NJ (and they tax us for almost everything), but even this would be news to me. Are you in the US? Or Canada? Again, maybe it is just a typo? Just want to be sure that you are not being charged for something you should not. Good luck with your new Edge! :beerchug:

Hi all. :D Lex has stated in his other thread that he understands where things went wrong here. So, of course it is up to all of you, but maybe we can give him a break (and a second chance), and let it ride for now? Heck, it is still the Holiday Season, right? Happy Hew Year everyone! :beerchug:

You are welcome, Lex. And I would be happy to help anytime. I hope your Edge gets here as soon as possible, I think you will love it! Good luck! :beerchug:

EDIT - Hi Lex. I was typing the response below at the same time as you were typing your last post in your other thread, so had not yet read or replied to it. That last post in your other thread was helpful, so I think we all understand the situation now. Again, Lex, I would be happy to help you whenever I can. Good luck! :beerchug: Hi Lex. I have been nothing but helpful, friendly and polite to you, so I would now ask you to please step back and take a deep breath before you type any more. I am not sure if you are directing your answer at me, but either way, you are beginning to cross the line of civility. We are here to help people, on our own time, so please keep it polite. We perfectly understand your questions. We are the "Experts" (your words not mine) that you are referring to. You are not understanding the answers, or are looking for more information/reassurance than we can give. Your "VOC" pricing sheet is correct, and all you need to do at this point is double check it against the "Factory Invoice" when your Edge comes in. All we are adding is, if you don't believe us, just go ask your Dealer. Please keep it polite, okay? Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D X-Plan pricing is not negotiable. Also, I don't understand why you say that "even the wheels I wanted from an SEL on a Limited that everyone - including people here and at the dealer (like my Salesman) - said 'is just not possible'," when it was I (and others here) that specifically told you to try negotiating the wheel switch. In fact, I gave you the suggestion, which you stated you used, to pitch the wheel switch as a Win-Win to the Dealer, and it worked.. What we told you would not happen, was being able to order both option packages you wanted (Premium and Seating) on the SEL. To get them you would need to order the Limited. Then, if you wanted the SEL wheels, you would need to work that out with the Dealership. Which is exactly what happened and exactly what you did. Please keep in mind that we are only trying to help you. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D There is no negotiating on an X-Plan price. You get the price available when you order. On an X-Plan sale (and in reality, any sale) it does not matter if the price increased the day before you ordered. If you want the old price, you will have to purchase an Edge from the Dealer stock that was ordered under the old pricing structure. The X-Plan price listed on the VOC and the Factory Invoice, is the X-Plan price, no if's ands or but's. Again, I am only trying to help, but your theory of "...if the last known increase was 6/6/07 and the dealer did not inform me of a price increase prior to ordering despite having talked 3 times in person, I have a leg to stand on to negotiate", is completely incorrect. The X-plan price is the X-Plan price. There is no clearer way to explain it. Your only question, if you insist on going further, is to ask the Dealer if/when the price increase occurred. And then, it is only to satisfy your curiosity, as an X-Plan sale is an X-Plan sale, and again, the price is the price. The Dealer cannot change the X-Plan price, it is set by Ford. If there was a price increase (and we all agree there must have been), you do not have a leg to stand on in any "negotiations". If you want to negotiate, you will no longer be purchasing on the X-Plan. So be ready for higher prices, and added "Fees and Charges". It cannot be put any simpler. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D Just as an FYI. The moderators always ask that Forum members avoid creating multiple posts concerning the same question. I think you now have at least 3 posts asking the same thing. It is also confusing for those of us trying to help you. How about closing out a few of them, and keeping this all in one post? Also, we are nicely trying to tell you that your VOC pricing is correct, but if you still have doubts, ask the Dealer, or continue to check the Ford website for the pricing update. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D Yes, ask the Dealer. As I mentioned in my previous post (#36 ), the prices on the VOC you sent me seem to all align correctly with the "Total Invoice" and "X-Plan" prices listed on it. The VOC is a printout from the Ford Ordering System, it is not really a "fudgeable" item. So it would seem that there has been a small price increase. But if you still have doubts, ask the Dealer In addition, the website pricing will probably soon be updated to reflect those changes. You are really causing yourself a lot of unecessary grief and worry. Just ask the Dealer. Also, as previously mentioned, your safety check is being sure that the X-Plan pricing on the VOC and the Factory Invoice match when your Edge arrives at the Dealership. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Grey! :D Thank you for that confirmation. There you go Lex! As we speculated in one of your othr posts, looks like a small price increase. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D Okay, I took a better look at the VOC you sent me. Here are the differences I noticed (and which you also saw): Ford Website - Base Retail $30,320 / Your VOC - Base Retail $30,555 (Difference + $235) Ford Website - Panoramic Roof $1,395 / Your VOC - Panoramic Sunroof $1,495 (Difference + $100) The Total Invoice Price on your VOC ($33,935.95) is correct, if the other pricing is correct. The X-Plan pricing calculation is as follows: Total Invoice Price X .996 + a $75 Administrative fee = the X-Plan Price. Using that calculation, we would come up with this calculation: $33,935.95 X .996 = $33,800.206 + $75 = $33,875.206 Round that figure up and you get $33,875.21. This figure matches the X-Plan price on your VOC exactly. The only thing I can surmise is there was some sort of price increase on the Base Retail/Invoice, and the Panoramic Roof? But at the moment, I can find no information to that effect. I think the best course of action is to ask the Dealer why there is a discrepancy between the published website pricing and your VOC, concerning the Edge Limited Base Retail Price (+$235), and the Panoramic Roof (+$100). Essentially, those two price differences, a total of $335 Retail (of course, the Invoice prices would be slightly less, but not much) seem to add up to your price difference concern. Let us know what they say. :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D See my other reply to this question. In addition, I checked the Ford website for the "Build Your Vehicle" price, and the retail price of the Panoramic Roof is shown as $1,395. Best thing you can do is call or visit the Dealer and ask why there is a price discrepancy. Let us know what they say. Good luck! :beerchug:

Edgieguy, you are correct (if you are talking about the date on the door jamb sticker). The date on the door jamb sticker is the month and year of production, not the day and month. But again, there is no way that you ordered an Edge on 12/7 and had it built anytime in December. It will take several weeks after you place an order, just to go through the Serialize, Segment, Sequence and Blend phases of production planning. Then it still has to be built. Then it has to be loaded on a rail car (this rarely happens immediately after production, it can sit for many days in a marshaling yard), then it has to be shipped by rail and then car carrier to your Dealer. To top it all off, all of this had to be accomplished in a month where the plants were shut down for the Christmas/New Year Holiday. This process does not take 22 days, ever. Not even in a non-Holiday month. The Edge you purchased was either transferred from another Dealer, or came in as a Stock Order that happened to be optioned just as you wanted it. Either way, I wish you many miles of safe and happy driving. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D The most likely solution to this mystery is that you missed something when comparing the two vehicles standard and optional equipment. And yes, the Moon Roof is listed on the stock Edge at $1,395. I have no idea why yours is listed at $1,495. Price increase? I don't know at this point. I really cannot solve this by going back and forth comparing things when I do not have all of the necessary information. If you would like to scan and PM me your "VOC" (black out any personal information), I can compare the equipment and price lists. But we will get no where fast like this. Please do not take this personally (as I am truly trying to help), but I have done this so many times, and seen the final result to usually be something was misread. Essentially, the X-Plan price is the X-Plan price. There really is no way for the Dealer to "fudge" the figures on the "VOC". And if the X-Plan price on your "VOC" matches the X-Plan price on the "Factory Invoice" when it comes in, all is well. You will drive yourself crazy doing it this way. Let me know if you want me to check further. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D The X-Plan price for that Edge is $33,924 (the MSRP is $36,055). So now you have a general idea what the X-Plan price should be on your Edge (not including the option difference). Interior color has no effect on price. As far as the price difference on the Moon Roof, I can't answer that at the moment. Maybe someone else has the definitive answer to that one, or you can pose that question to the Dealer? Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D Yes "VOC" = Vehicle Order Confirmation, sorry that wasn't clear for some reason. Did your Dealer also give you an order form listing the X-Plan price, tax, Title and Registration Fees, Doc Fee, etc. In other words, the price out the door, not including Incentives, since they may change? They may not have, since the deal specifics may will change if the Incentives do. It wouldn't hurt to ask for all of the specifics, excluding Incentives, at this point. Moving on, to answer your questions: 1 - It is highly doubtful that they would try to pull something like you are worried about, then put it in writing and hand it to you as evidence. 2 - The VOC comes from the Ford Ordering System. While everything is itemized, it is the price listed next to "X-Plan" on the "VOC" that you should be concerned about. Forget the other prices, fees, etc, etc. listed on the "VOC". To you, all of that is now unnecessary fluff. If they are going to charge you a "Doc Fee", it will be on the "Final Purchase Contract" along with the Tax, Title and Registration Fees. It will not be listed on the "VOC". The "VOC' is just the confirmation that the order has been received into the Ford System. 3 - Yes, you definitely did the right thing. While you will see interesting stories by people who say they beat X-Plan pricing on their own, except for an extremely small percentage of these stories, they essentially were taken and did not know it (by additional fees, slick salesmanship, higher APR rates on their loans etc, etc). The ones who were able to get a better than X-Plan price were purchasing very low demand vehicles. The Edge does not qualify as one of those. There is one way that I/we can help you be sure the X-Plan price listed is correct (although at this point I believe it is): If you like, go to Fordvehicles.com. Once there, click on "Search Dealer Inventory". Follow the prompts to do a search of the Dealer Inventory in your ZIP Code (or any other). Find an EDGE Limited that is optioned exactly like yours. Once you find one, come back here and post the VIN, along with the Dealer name and ZIP Code. I can then find out the exact X-Plan price for that vehicle, which will be the same as your X-Plan price. I really think at this point, from the information you have in your hands, the Dealer seems to be following the rules. But it never hurts to keep your eyes open. If you wish, come back with another Dealer Stock Edge and we will price it for you. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D Holy Mother of Pearl, I was afraid of this next. Okay, let me try to explain in some sort of coherent fashion: Since you ordered, there would not be a "Factory Invoice" yet. However, the Dealer did give you the computer sheet which has "Vehicle Order Confirmation" printed across the top. This is good. As you mentioned this sheet has all of your order specifics (Vehicle, Model, Trim Level, Interior and Exterior Colors, Options, etc, etc.), and the Retail and Invoice pricing. On this sheet, the field labeled "X-Plan", is your X-Plan price. That will be your base X-Plan price (before eligible Incentives are deducted). That X-Plan price already includes all fees, including the FDAF, Dest, Delivery, etc, etc. The only "Fee" not included is a $75 maximum "Documentation Charge" (or 'Fee'). The only charges a Dealer may add to that X-Plan price are the following: Tax, Title and Registration, the above mentioned $75 maximum "Documentation Fee" and any Dealer Installed Accessories which you agree to in the contract (i.e. pinstriping, extended warranties, etc.). Then, when your vehicle arrives at the Dealership, they will also get the "Factory Invoice". They are required by Ford, to show you the original, and give you a copy of the "Factory Invoice". On this Factory invoice will be a box labeled "X-Plan". Again, the price in this box is your X-Plan price (before Incentives). This price should match the price which was on the "Vehicle Order Confirmation Sheet" that you received when you ordered the vehicle. Also, it would not hurt your situation to send a PM to the Ford Employee who provided your X-Plan PIN and ask them to sign you up for the FordMyPlan website. It explains all of the ins and outs of the Plan, what your rights are, what the Dealer is required to do, etc, etc. Hopefully, the Ford Employee will be nice enough to do that for you. Hope this information helps. Good luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D Your Dealer is correct. You cannot "lock in" the current Incentives. On certain Plan purchases, you can "lock in" the price of the vehicle as protection against price increases before delivery. But that is not the same as "locking in" Incentives. Two different situations. In addition, you can sometimes "lock in" the "everyday" (non Incentive) loan rate. But that does not help you, as you would be looking to "lock in" the Incentive rate (3.9%). Incentives cannot be "locked in". A buyer is only eligible for the Incentives available when they actually purchase the vehicle. If you "Factory Order", you will receive the Incentives available when your vehicle comes in and you finalize the sale. I would not worry about that very much, as an educated guess would say that with the state of the economy and car sales, the Incentives will likely stay the same, or increase. So this will hopefully work in your favor. Goods luck! :beerchug:

Hi Lex. :D Glad it all worked out in the end. Additionally, there are rules the Dealer must follow for X-Plan sales. First, did they show you the "Factory Invoice" (not the "MSRP" Window Sticker) with the box labeled "X-Plan"? Did they give you a copy of that "Factory Invoice"? They are required to do those things. Also, be sure the Dealer charged you no extra fees, other than Tax, Title and Registration and a "Documentation Fee" (which according to X-Plan rules is limited to a $75 maximum). I hope your wait is not too long, and good luck! :beerchug:

Hi again Lex. :D Forgot to mention just how much I agree with your earlier statement about selling your old car privately. If you look at any of my earlier posts concerning the subject of Private Sales vs, Trade-ins, that is exactly what I always recommend to anyone who will listen. For some reason, it is a hard sell to some people. I myself never have a problem earning a few thousand dollars profit (even including the sales tax ramifications) over what a Dealer will offer on trade-in. Glad you have thought ahead and included that in your automotive purchasing and financial plans. Good luck! :beerchug: