mjonis

Yes, I did originally, but it's 9" shorter in length. However, I will admit that if it's 9" shorter, it still has the "same" amount of cargo space (or so they claim), but that may come at the expense of the 2nd row legroom. Which reminds me, I need to measure that too. One of the few redeeming qualities of my POS is that it has/had the most legroom in 2nd row at the time. I'll have to write that down on the spreadsheet and actually sit in the back with the front seat back all the way and see if my knees touch.

LOL! I sometimes am, but I did that with my Lemonox and I've regretted it ever since. Plus it's a huge chunk 'o money for me.

Original thesis: Replace 2005 Chevy Equinox LT AWD. Initial requirements for what to replace with: a) Must be approx. same size (length, height, width) Must have same "power" (Chevy is a V6) c) Must get same or better gas mileage d) Must have heated steering wheel e) Must have smartphone integration and/or AA/Carplay d) Must have heated/cool front seats e) Must have heated rear seats f) Must have AWD g) Must NOT be a GM product. Burned by GM too much with this car Based upon initial "must haves", and web research (did look on the web at Lexus, Acura, Toyota Highlander), the initial list: Ford Edge Subaru Outback/Forester Nissan Murano Hyundai Santa Fe Sport Initial I test drove: 2015 Ford Edge SEL (nobody had the Titanium) w/ecoboost 2016 Subaru's (fully loaded) 2015 Nissan Murano Platinum 2016 Hyundai SFS 2.0 Turbo w/tech AWD 2016 Kia Sorento SXL Turbo ALL vehicles are AWD and fully loaded. Immediately ruled out the Subaru's for 2 reasons: a) No heated steering wheel Both have Very loud engine/road noise. 85db on the Outback and lots of wind noise (problem on that year model). Of the 4 remaining, I liked the Nissan the best, although it was slightly larger but the V6 and gas mileage, coupled with very stylish interior made it my first choice. However, lack of ANY smartphone integration killed it. Nissan disabled all Nissan Connect features in their Platinum (or anything with the NAV head unit) for no apparent reason. to this day, even the 2016 models have all those features disabled. Only Google Search works. Nissan refuses to say why or when (if ever) they will re-enable. Rumor is that the 2017 will have AA/Carplay. OK, so that leaves 3. Of the 3, it was almost a tie with the Ford/Kia. However, massive QA issues with the 2015 (water leaks, tail light condensation, etc) and that Sync 3 was coming out, kinda ruled that out. I decided to wait until next year. So now we are "next year". Was going to wait ANOTHER year and maybe pick up a used "whichever" one won on this round. But the Chevy POS Lemonox said otherwise (more repairs). Testing Methodology: Originally used Samsung Galaxy S4 with sound meter app, and g-force app to measure loudness in db and "smoothness" in g-forces. Drove same route (from home to work, turn around, come back). Gives good mix of low/high speeds, and lots of potholes. This was to provide objective data for how loud something was. Also input data into spreadsheet and finally assigned weighting and scores. Weighting because not all items are "as important" as others, but they do make a difference--to me. Ultimately by this Sunday will make a decision in terms of ranking #1, #2, #3. Then we start with the negotiations. There is almost an $8k price difference between the lowest MSRP (Hyundai) and the highest (Kia). That may be a factor if my #1 can't be purchased for what I want. 2016 Ford Edge Titanium, 302A, Driver's Pkg, Cold Weather Pkg, Ecoboost Finally found a dealer locally with a 2016 Ford Edge Titanium with 302A package. However, it's white (ugh) and doesn't have the Driver's Package. But for test drive purposes, it will suffice. It did not seem as quiet/smooth as the 2015 SEL that I remember. Unfortunately I also switched smartphones from Android (Samsung Galaxy S4) to iPhone 6s, so my sound meter measurements and g-force measurements from before were off. (different apps, different phones). Seat backs did not cool at all. This is a known issue. Requires TSB and also third-party product $350 to actually fix. Taking a 2nd test drive this weekend to reconfirm. As it currently stands, main cons with the Ford are lack of availability. Only one dealer in a 100 mile radius has an Edige Titanium with 302A, drivers package, cold weather package. Unfortunately it's in a color I don't particularly want (red) and has 20" rims. All the other dealers that have a color I want with the packages (regardless of tire size) are all V6 engines, not ecoboost. This may be a major issue as it will hamper price negotiations. Overall I like the exterior and interior styling of the Ford. I like a lot of the features. My biggest dislikes: No fog lights, have to purchase extra modules for smartphone remote start, have to purchase extended warranty, possible QA issues still with fit/trim, and random squeeks/noises. I hate random squeeks/noises. 2017 Hyundai Santa Fe Sport AWD 2.0 Turbo Ultimate w/tech Package Hyundai has updated the 2017 model with AA/Carplay support, added DRL, more comfortable seats (or so they say), and seems to have smoothed the ride and noise compared to the 2016 model year. However sales guy was blabbing the whole time so taking another test drive this weekend sans sales guy. Overall this vehicle is the best value for the money, IMO. I like the exterior look and interior look. Slight turbo lag. Regular Santa Fe is too large and I don't want third row or really bad gas mileage that it has. It's even larger than the Murano, which was my max size. While it has remote smartphone app via BluLink, it has most annoying feature of requiring the doors be locked, and while the car is running it flashes your hazard lights. Apparently lots of people have had police/security/etc. called because "someone's car has the hazard lights on and nobody's there". Would require aftermarket solution to bypass. Some 2017 Santa Fe (I think 18 or 23 complaints to NHTSA so far) have acceleration issues. There is confusion as to if the Sport is affected, I see 2 complaints on the forums about it. Supposedly Hyundai has a programming fix, but it's not for the Sport. This could be a serious issue (almost getting hit, etc.). Did not observe during test drive, but that doesn't mean anything. Since the fix for the Santa Fe appears to have worked, lurking to see what the Sport outcome is. Local dealers do have units in stock with the color I want. Don't particularlyl care for the gas pedal that's attached to the floor. Makes it impossible to get any floor mat to go behind it, so the salt in the winter will drip onto the actual carpet. Kia has same issue. 2017 Kia Sorento SXL V6 Limited Taking test drive this weekend. Shortage in our immediate local area (50 miles) of V6. Supposedly unit is back-ordered due to V6 parts (remember Kia discontinued the Turbo version, so you can only get V6 version). If I remember from the 2016 test drive, it was just as quiet/smooth as the Ford, if not slightly more so. I love the surround-view camera (much better than the "self-parking") and 10 year warranty. Things about the 2017 I do not like: possibly poor gas mileage (although the few "combined" reports on the Fuelly website indicate it's getting better than stated--this may be due to Kia being very conservative on EPA statements since they got in trouble a few years ago for overstating results). Don't like loss of storage space underneath cargo due to mandatory 3rd row seats. The interior styling is NOT sleek at all. For some reason neither is the Lexus or other "high end" SUV. Dunno why. Also most expensive MSRP of all. But it has so many features. Don't like missing the DRL though. I think I'd rather have fogs more than DRL. Same issue as Hyundai with gas pedal. But seeing no complaints (yet) about QA issues with 2017. Only complaints about 2016 were with the Panoramic roof (edge has same issues that I see). Kia supposedly has a long-term fix but it requires complete replacement of the entire glass/rails/panel assembly. For some reason Hyundai doesn't seem to have the issue. Things I have to do for test drives this weekend: re-measure loudness/smoothness Sit in the car for 30-45 minutes whilst playing with the infotainment area. This will let me observe how "comfortable" the seats are vs. a 15 minute test drive. I found out my roomate's 2014 Hyundai has the most uncomfortable driver seat after about 30 minutes (the end is up "too high" even at its lowest setting for me and it puts too much pressur on my thigh). So here's my spreadsheet as it stands. (ignore the lease calcs/price stuff, I was just playing "what if"). https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-gsOu2-WzByy2qsJcD4xNMaOb8kKvCepkbwIB7splFc/edit?usp=sharing

My bad, I muddied the waters. I always thought puddle lamps were like on the sides (near door bottoms) or something. So I thought they were different. However, I do suppose one could use puddle lamps (if they're near door bottoms) as a "security" light (ie, you approach vehicle, or you push button on key fob). So, as I now understand it: Ford Edge Titanium has some sort of lamps that you MANUALLY make light up as you "approach" the car. However, it's not an automatic sensing thingy. The lights that DO light up when pressed are actually on the bottom side of the side mirrors, and obviously shine down, and therefore are also "puddle" lamps. Is that right? What about any lights on the door handles themselves? (I'll check tomorrow and Saturday when I do my 2 test drives at 2 diff. dealers, but only one has the 302A package).

Yeah, I know. I was so bummed that the 2017 they discontinued the SXL in the Turbo (the 5 seater model). Now for SXL you have to get V6 which means you have the stupid 3rd row and lose the storage. Forgot about the 3rd row weight, that would make perfect sense. But I'm going to test drive it anyway. trying to keep a semi-open mind. According to my calcs/spreadsheet, the under cargo storage area doesn't matter that much (ie, it's not like my #1 priority). I'll be posting my spreadsheet shortly (at least as far as I've completed it) for thoughts/ideas. Sometimes I miss things that I should take into consideration (like I just remembered to bring my water bottle and make sure it fits in the holder instead of flopping around like it does in my current car). Or actually measuring the opening for the rear trunk to make sure it fits whatever I may need to stuff in there (my Equinox is wider at the bottom than the top and it's burned me a few times going to buy something and then I can't fit it in there and have to pay delivery or borrow someone's truck).

Awesome, thanks for the info! The PDF brochure (finally found it) has listed: security approach lamps As part of the heated side mirrors. Looks like it's on SEL and Titanium (didn't check the Sport) Interesting though that they consider those puddle lamps as well.

Interesting. On the 2016 AWD Titanium and 2017 Sorento SXL V6 it's almost opposite for curb weight. Ford: 4078 Sorento: 4343 Didn't realize that AWD added that much, but apparently it does. I'd agree that the Sorento looks heavier (in my case, it is). Interestingly, the cargo areas are almost identical for the cubic feet they claim it can hold, but I'm going to measure, because I'm pretty sure the sloped roof of the Ford eats into that (as does the Hyundai, and even my Equinox). But maybe the trunk sits up higher. I have to write these down on my spreadsheets.

On the 2016 Edge Titanium, does it come with: security/welcome lights? (The best I can describe is what the Hyundai/Kia have where it "senses" the keyfob and illuminates LED lighting in the door handles). The Ford site is vague (IMO) on details. Entry lights? (i'm assuming these are the illuminated scuff panel thingies) Puddle lights? I thought I'd read/seen somewhere that the Edge has lights also on the side mirrors that shines down.

While I've not personally observed this (only one 2016 test drive), I'm seeing some overall "general" issues with the 2016: a) random rattles/squeeks that show up relatively quickly - most seem to be fixable via re-welding or jamming random bits and pieces of insulation/foam to keep things quiet. This, IMO, is one of my pet peeves (noises) and I'm a bit concerned about Ford's QA on this vehicle with what appears to be a common issue (for those that report issues). Ironically my POS Chevy doesn't seem to have random noises like that (about the worst it has is if I hit a pothole and it moves this plastic thingy in the back that covers that gap between the trunk and rear seats if you fold them down). Panoramic roof issues. (although to be fair, I'm seeing the SAME complaints on the Kia forums as well). Seems to be a constant lube maintenance that you either pay for, or do yourself, although supposedly Kia has a fix that requires a complete replacement of the ENTIRE unit (rails, glass, etc.). And, the seatback issue, but that I've experienced. Since the last item is fixable at a cost, I'm more concerned about "a" and "b". "b" being a royal PITA to have to constantly upkeep (although granted, not every vehicle seems to be experiencing this, but it's not like you know until you go to open/close the sucker and it doesn't want to work all the way). "a" is the most annoying, IMO, and things like that shouldn't be occurring if the QA is right. So I'd put those on my "dislike" list as well, even though I've not had the 2 items (maybe I'll get lucky and have random noises in my 2nd test drive--not).

Nice!, thanks for the link to the manual.

Does the 2016 Edge have independent key fob memory settings for seats/mirrors, etc? In other words: Fob #1 is for driver #1 and has settings for Driver #1 for seats, mirrors, etc. Fob #2 is for driver #2 and has different settings for Driver #2? I believe both my "competitors" (Kia/Hyundai) don't offer this feature (there's buttons you press inside the car instead). thanks!

BT4 may expand the bitrate, but not sure if Android supports it. I'd have to look up iOS vs. Android. I know with Android 4.2 at least, that Google never allowed the full range of BT profiles. iOS does. One of the reasons, on the Pioneer head unit I have, anyway, that if you have iPhone, using regular BT audio, you can actually use the steering wheel controls to go through folders, etc. But on Android you can't because Google didn't allow one of the profiles needed for that. I did notice (again, specific to my Pioneer head unit which does NOT support BT 4) that streaming the iTunes stuff via Android doesn't sound as good as it does over lightning cable with iPhone. Note, that on the Pioneer 4000 NEX, iPhone only uses USB/Lightning cable if you're in carplay mode. Otherwise, both iPhone and Android in "app radio" mode, stream all the audio via bluetooth and it uses HDMI for the video syncing to the head unit (which, BTW is touchy with Android, not sure about iPhone).

LOL, thanks! I assume that of the vehicles listed, only 2 (if I'm reading correctly) are 4-cylinder ecoboosts, one at 20.8 and 24.7 mpg. So if yours is with FWD, I'm thinking the other is with the AWD. Does yours have the auto start/stop thingy? Ford's site lists the EPA at: FWD: 20 city/30 hwy/24 combined mpg FWD with Start/Stop: 21 city/30 hwy/24 combined mpg AWD: 20 city/28 hwy/23 combined mpg So yours looks pretty spot on, IMO, for the FWD (regardless of stop/start) if I assume "combined". The other vehicle could either be mostly city driving. I'm mainly asking as the Ford and Hyundai fuelly mpgs seem a bit low compared to EPA numbers, whilst the Kia Sorento seems "above" the numbers. Although I do remember reading somewhere where Kia had issues a few years back with overstating EPA numbers, so maybe now they're "under-reporting"? I know when my 2005 Lemonox was first released, EPA was 19mpg city. After many complaints of hardly anyone getting that, they lowered it to 18 mpg city. I'm just a bit surprised that a V6 sorento is getting better observable vs. the Ford with the ecoboost. But I don't know much about engines. I was hoping more people would post their info on fuelly as 1-2 vehicles doesn't really mean "real world" as those could be outliers.

For those of you with a 2015/2016 Edge AWD, with the 4 cylinder ecoboost: What's your observed gas mileage? I ask because fuelly results don't look that hot for the Ford, IMO. But it's hard to see (without drilling down) if they're FWD, v6, etc. http://www.fuelly.com/car/ford/edge?engineconfig_id=13&bodytype_id=&submodel_id=

I'm assuming it's linking via bluetooth then (degredation of audio quality, IMO) vs.Carplay with lightning connector? Or does it use wi-fi direct? Obviously without a wired connection there's no actual mirroring of the display, so you're probably dependent on whatever applink shows you? (although same with AA/Carplay). I will say my iPhone (I used to have Android) is much better on the battery/heat than Android. Although I thought I read that AA requires USB connection (no wireless yet). But I could be wrong.

SharkTank. $49.99 haha

I'm guessing, by my reading of the 2017 order guide that the Windshield de-icer thingy is only on the 2017? (the thingy that heats up--supposedly--the windshield wipers or something to keep them from freezing/sticking)? Just filling in my last few empty spots on the 'ol spreadsheet.

I thought on the 2015 SEL I looked at, you could lift up the "floor" on the cargo area and there were some little compartments for storage? I know the Hyundai has it (but not the Kia Sorento SXL V6 as they put the 3rd row seat in there). Or was I smoking crack that day?

OMG, how dumb (IMO). That's a bit of a letdown since the other thread regarding the fogs, you'd have to cut and cob-job (IMO) the assembly so the lights would fit (tape, etc.) How strange that the Chinese market/version has 'em and the US one doesn't. You'd almost think you could just order the chinese lamps/assembly with the brackets and they'd just fit, but guess the bumper or something is also different, so there's no spot to attach anything to.

Faster than a speed bullet! LOL!

You referring to this? "In order to install the fog lamp, additional brackets are required to properly mount the fog lamps" Do they not sell said "additional brackets"? LOL

Please keep posting with your results of these lamps and install instructions. I think that'll help a few folks (maybe me included). Thanks again for posting your info/videos so far!

But you can get similar now with the 2015/2016. In the remote starter forums, someone bought the kit (I think there's a kit and a security kit thingy you need) and then you can use your smartphone to start/unlock the car.

Thanks! Looks a tad more involved than what I'm used to, so if I choose the Edge, will have to find some company to install for me. Why Ford doesn't have an "american" kit for the fogs (or fogs at all) is beyond me. but then again why Kia doesn't have DRL is beyond me (if you get the Canadian Sorento it has it because Canada apparently requires all vehicles to have DRL by law).

So looks like the 2017 isn't getting fog lights either. I *think* the Chinese version has fog lights? But anyone know if there's a "kit" you can buy aftermarket for fog lights? And if so, how hideous to install?