SteveO Posted May 9, 2009 Report Share Posted May 9, 2009 (edited) I have always used synthetic motor oil (Mobil 1). I will be taking delivery of my new Edge later this month. Is there any reason why I should not change the oil to Mobil 1 immediately? Also, would this have any impact on the warranty if I do it myself? I am concerned about the level of maintenance documentation Ford would require if there is ever a engine warranty issue. Regards, Steve Edited May 9, 2009 by SteveO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hydro Posted May 9, 2009 Report Share Posted May 9, 2009 (edited) Synthetic won't matter for warranty issues. Just make sure you're using the correct viscosity, otherwise you will have warranty issues if there is engine failure and they perform an oil analysis. If you are doing the oil yourself, at the very minimum I'd keep all reciepts for your oil purchases and write the date of the change on your oil filter with a Sharpie. On a diesel forum I visit manufactures are trying to blame owner neglect on engine failures. So, Cover Your AS$!! Edited May 9, 2009 by hydro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500 h.o. Posted May 9, 2009 Report Share Posted May 9, 2009 Synthetic won't matter for warranty issues. Just make sure you're using the correct viscosity, otherwise you will have warranty issues if there is engine failure and they perform an oil analysis. If you are doing the oil yourself, at the very minimum I'd keep all reciepts for your oil purchases and write the date of the change on your oil filter with a Sharpie. On a diesel forum I visit manufactures are trying to blame owner neglect on engine failures. So, Cover Your AS$!! I own a 2008 Super Duty and belong to several forums and I'm constantly reading about warranty denials for one thing or another, oil being one of them along with emissions issues. Ford is a real humdinger when it comes to denying warranties. Personally, I'm waiting until my warranty is out before straying too far from stock. We can all offer all sorts of opinions and quote all kinds of legal precedents but when it comes right down to it, Ford has us by the cajones. It's "Who's right, who's wrong and who holds the warranty". Just my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
computerguy Posted May 9, 2009 Report Share Posted May 9, 2009 (edited) I wouldn't change immediately, wait until some break-in occurs. I'm approaching 3,000 miles on my Edge and will soon have the Ford dealer make the first oil and filter change. Personally, here is what I'm going to do. Use either Motorcraft or Wix filters (probably stay with Motorcraft since they are really decent filters and OEM), change to Synthetic Royal Purple 5W30 (I know 5W20 is recommended - but the ambient temp gets up to 100 degrees here in south Georgia in the summer). I actually went to the Ford dealer a couple of weeks ago with 2,000 miles on the odometer, and they talked me out of the oil change, said wait at least until 3,000 miles. By the way, if I furnish the oil and filter, they only charge $10 for doing the work. Edited May 9, 2009 by computerguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DUCKRACER Posted May 9, 2009 Report Share Posted May 9, 2009 (edited) I have always used synthetic motor oil (Mobil 1). I will be taking delivery of my new Edge later this month. Is there any reason why I should not change the oil to Mobil 1 immediately? Also, would this have any impact on the warranty if I do it myself? I am concerned about the level of maintenance documentation Ford would require if there is ever a engine warranty issue. Regards, Steve I agree with 500ho and Computer guy. Synthetic oils reduce friction so much that you won't get proper break-in wear. Personally, I would go to synthetic at 6,000 mi. and then only with a FORD synthetic if there is such a thing. Until my warranty is up I have the Ford dealer do ALL maintenance. Here is why. First, as 500ho said Ford (like most manufacturers) is a stickler on warranty repairs. If you dealer does the repair and maintenance on your vehicle, they have little to argue with. Second, most ford dealers will update the most recent "flashes" to your cars computer and will automatically perform any recalls. NO Jiffy-lube can do that. Lastly, most Ford dealers charge about the same as you local oil change store. I hope this helps. Edited May 9, 2009 by DUCKRACER Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Posted May 9, 2009 Report Share Posted May 9, 2009 (edited) Ford has a full synthetic 5w20 oil. Wait until you have rings seated, etc. before you change over to full synthetic (unless you are operating in a sub-zero environment.) 5-6,000 miles will cover the break-in. Do not put a 5w30 oil in your vehicle - only 5w20 or 0w20. Our engines are designed to operate at 212 degrees and need an oil with a cSt value of 8- 9 at that temperature. Your oil is integral to the lubrication and cooling systems of your engine. The only time you might justify a 5w30 weight oil is when you are consistently operating your engine at 300 degrees (heavy towing or all out racing). For 95+% of us, you can't beat the Semi-Synthetic Motorcraft 5w20 oil. Lubrication is a customer responsibility. Most of the time when there is a lubrication related concern, it is customer responsibility - run low on oil or coolant, lack of maintenance, wrong products used (oil and/or filter), etc. Receipts from the corner luber or parts store won't help you if you have a sludged valve train, burned out bearings, etc. that obviously came from improper products or maintenance. If you have the corner shop do your maintenance, ask for a copy of their warranty. You might need it if they don't use products that meet the Ford specs, forget to actually change the oil or filter, double gasket the filter and cause you to run out of oil, etc. If you trust they will replace an $8,000 engine if they made a mistake, then use them. If a Ford dealer makes a mistake that costs an engine, they are more likely to stand behind their work. Here is a question to ask the Oil Experts that try to tell you their oil is better than the Motorcraft oil: How many times did you test your formulation against the Ford Specification before you got a "Pass"? If 9 times it failed and one time it passed - they call it a good formulation. The Motorcraft oils will pass every time, every batch. Out of warranty, do whatever you want, but I don't think you will find anything better than Motorcraft products. As I recall they have a national $10 consumer refund on a $39.95 oil change with tire rotation. Protect you engine and add life to your tires for $29.95. :happy feet: :happy feet: Edited May 11, 2009 by Grey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
computerguy Posted May 11, 2009 Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 (edited) I emailed Royal Purple and they said either 5w20 or 5w30 would be fine for the Edge - just might not want to tell the dealer if I used 5w30 since it would give them a possible 'out' for any warranty issues that may come up. I called and spoke with the service dept a the Ford dealership and they said they would recommend 5w30 because "we're not in Detroit and it gets really hot down here". I then asked that if I use 5w30 and had some engine issues would that be held against me. He said "No, that would no be a problem". I've known this guy for over thirty years and he would not lie to me about it. As a matter of fact when my 2004 Explorer had to have the transmission repaired at 56,000 miles (warranty ended at 36,000) he had it done at no charge. Again, these are my thoughts and if I lived in a cooler climate, I might possibly stay with 5w20. The reply from Royal Purple also stated: "Ford has been using the 5W20's for over 8 years and I have not heard or seen any additional engine problems - they went to this for added fuel economy." Edited May 11, 2009 by computerguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Posted May 11, 2009 Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 Good oil pressure = lubrication. Wrong. Good flow = lubrication. High ambient temperatures require thicker oil. Wrong - engines are designed to operate at a certain temperature range. The oil specified for that operating temperature ties to the engine cooling strategy and the clearances built into the engine design. It's hotter in Florida than it is in Detroit - - - If your engine is operating a 212 degrees F, it doesn't matter if it is Detroit or Death Valley. 212 degrees is 212 degrees. Out engines are designed to an oil viscosity value of 8 or so at operating temperatures. A 5w30 oil will have close to 11 at 212 degrees. That restricts flow, reduces lubrication and usually contributes to overheating. Ask your guy to call Ford Engine Engineering or the Motorcraft Service Engineering group to see if it is ok to recommend something to owners that they don't recommend. If it doesn't meet the Ford specification M2C930A - don't use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
computerguy Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 Grey - Thanks for all the informative input. Where did you find the cSt spec for the Edge engine? Royal Purple is rated at 11 cSt @ 100c for the 5w30, and 8.7 for the 5w20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 Grey - Thanks for all the informative input. Where did you find the cSt spec for the Edge engine? Royal Purple is rated at 11 cSt @ 100c for the 5w30, and 8.7 for the 5w20 A. From the Ford Powertrain and service engineering groups. They work together to develop the specifications for service oils - which they translate to Motorcraft 5w20. B. Correct - 11 cSt is too high for optimum lubrication and cooling at operating temperature. BTW, as much as 90% of engine wear occurs at start-up. You want a low cSt value at 75 degrees (not just for fuel economy.) If you are in the far North, (sub-zero conditions) look at 0w20 oils that meet the Ford Specification. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hydro Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 Thanks for the info Grey, good stuff to know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlazedUp Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) As for rings not seating properly by switching to a full synthetic @1,000 miles is false. Porsches, lambos, vets come with mobil 1 from the factory. A 0W-20 will flow much better at start-up than a 5W-20 because the viscosity of the 0 weight is thinner. When warmed up to temp, 0W-20 and 5W-20 have the same viscosity. Warrantys can be denied for anything but using full synthetic or switching to 0W will not void your warranty. I switched to mobil1 0W-20 @ 15,000 miles and gained a little over 1 mpg......it adds up ! Motorcraft oil is one of the best oils out there....it is cheap and well made. When they make a full synthetic in 0 weight, I will switch. There were many tests conducted for the benefits of using synthetic such as a test where synthetic was put in a car for 50,000 miles and then torn down and examined. There were no signs of wear on the engine components and the oil was still usable. Bottom line, if you can afford to use full synthetics, do so and never look back.....Theres a reason they call non-synthetic oil....."dino oil" :yup: Edited May 13, 2009 by BlazedUp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) As for rings not seating properly by switching to a full synthetic @1,000 miles is false. Porsches, lambos, vets come with mobil 1 from the factory. : So what - those engine cylinders are honed differently and the ring design is different. Too slick too soon can lead to cylinder wall glazing and barrel shaping of the rings. But, do whatever you want. It probably won't hurt a thing. At worst, the outcomes will only be more oil consumption, lower compression and fouled plugs. Edited May 13, 2009 by Grey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 As for rings not seating properly by switching to a full synthetic @1,000 miles is false. Porsches, lambos, vets come with mobil 1 from the factory. A 0W-20 will flow much better at start-up than a 5W-20 because the viscosity of the 0 weight is thinner. When warmed up to temp, 0W-20 and 5W-20 have the same viscosity. Warrantys can be denied for anything but using full synthetic or switching to 0W will not void your warranty. I switched to mobil1 0W-20 @ 15,000 miles and gained a little over 1 mpg......it adds up ! Motorcraft oil is one of the best oils out there....it is cheap and well made. When they make a full synthetic in 0 weight, I will switch. There were many tests conducted for the benefits of using synthetic such as a test where synthetic was put in a car for 50,000 miles and then torn down and examined. There were no signs of wear on the engine components and the oil was still usable. Bottom line, if you can afford to use full synthetics, do so and never look back.....Theres a reason they call non-synthetic oil....."dino oil" :yup: Interesting that you think you know more about engines and oil than the Ford engineers who design and build them. You don't need 0W anything unless you live in extreme cold. Just because an oil is synthetic doesn't mean it meets the required Specifications from Ford. If it doesn't meet the spec then it's grounds for warranty denial. Period. Use what you want but at least make sure it meets the spec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlazedUp Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 Ford WSS-M2C930-A Mobil 1 meets the ford specifications. I do not claim to know more than ford engineers and I do not understand the hostility towards myself. Wether it's -20 degrees outside or 100 degrees, faster, easier oil flow at start-up is critical. You people really need to educate yourself before spouting off on here when all I was trying to do is offer some helpful advice......sheesh ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Nap Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 I just go to Walmart and get the Motorcraft 5w-20 Blend and Motocraft Filter and call it a day.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
computerguy Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 Today I returned my Royal Purple 5w30 to the parts store and swapped it for RP 5w20. The parts guy said "why in the world do you want to swap 5w30 for 5w20?". I tried to explain about cSt and such, but I could tell that he didn't have a clue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlazedUp Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Today I returned my Royal Purple 5w30 to the parts store and swapped it for RP 5w20.The parts guy said "why in the world do you want to swap 5w30 for 5w20?". I tried to explain about cSt and such, but I could tell that he didn't have a clue. That "parts guy" must be related to akirby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 (edited) Today I returned my Royal Purple 5w30 to the parts store and swapped it for RP 5w20.The parts guy said "why in the world do you want to swap 5w30 for 5w20?". I tried to explain about cSt and such, but I could tell that he didn't have a clue. Good call. Most people think that oil thins at high temperature. It is more correct to consider that oil thickens at lower temperatures. Years ago, manufacturers specified different weight oils for summer and for winter operation. Back then, engine operating temperature varied with ambient temperatures. Today, our engines are designed to operate @212 degrees F, in Florida and Alaska. They are designed to operate with an oil having a cSt value of about 9 at that temperature regardless of ambient temperature. Thus we always want an oil that has a cSt value of around 9 at 212 degrees. The purpose of a 0W or 5W multiviscosity oil is to reduce oil thickening at lower temperatures. Oil is always too thick at start-up. We would like to have a cSt of 9 at start-up, but oil thickens much more than that at lower temperatures. So, stick with 0W20 or 5W20 to help reduce engine wear at start-up. The cooler your ambient temperature, the better the argument for 0W20 or 5W20 full-synthetic. And, let your engine warm up before going full throttle, especially on cold mornings. Remember, high pressure doesn't = lubrication, Flow = lubrication. Edited May 14, 2009 by Grey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 That "parts guy" must be related to akirby. You say switching to synthetic immediately won't hurt anything. Ford engineers say differently. You say using a full synthetic won't void your warranty. It can IF it doesn't meet the Ford specs. The issues can be avoided by waiting until the first scheduled oil change to switch to full synthetic and only use a full synthetic that meets Ford specifications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mernt Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 You say switching to synthetic immediately won't hurt anything. Ford engineers say differently. You say using a full synthetic won't void your warranty. It can IF it doesn't meet the Ford specs. The issues can be avoided by waiting until the first scheduled oil change to switch to full synthetic and only use a full synthetic that meets Ford specifications. Has anyone noticed that the latest Product Data Sheet for Mobil 1 5w-20 no longer says "Meets or Exceeds"? It now uses Amsoil language and says "suitable for". Their 0w-20 says "Meets and Exceeds" the Ford WSS spec. https://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorO...il_1_5W-20.aspx vs https://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorO...il_1_0W-20.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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