sixponies Posted October 29, 2014 Report Share Posted October 29, 2014 Back on Topic... New member. HUGE thanks for the posts so far. You let me know what to look for... My 12 Edge was stalling over and over. I made it happen after my wife told me... I just drove it aggressively and it died fairly quickly (showed the wrench etc). It reset when I restarted... First trip to the dealer(after multiple stalls), no repair, dealer could not duplicate. -Car died 2 days later (and more times) Second trip to dealer, Replaced canister purge valve (I let them know that this sounded like a throttle body issue) -Car died a few days later Third trip- They replaced the MAF sensor ("We cant do anything without a code for the Throttle body") Car Died again. This last time, they sent a tow truck because my wife simply would not drive the vehicle again. They also sent a rental car. I called Ford Corp and started a case with them as well. I told them that I would not let my wife and children back in that vehicle and that, given the history here I was surprised that there wasn't a recall and or a class action suite not based on injuries but on time / effort / stress... Ford got together with the dealer and they hooked up the blackbox and had a tech drive the car for a few days and it stalled again and the tech hit the button while it was failing and it gave "THE code"... P2111 - Throttle Body actuator Here's the deal. When you restart your vehicle, the code clears because the Throttle body actuator resets and is no longer stuck... They'll likely only find this with the black box because it records the systems history while driving and saves everything for a few minutes before and after you hit the "mark" button when the vehicle dies. It seemed like the dealer wanted to help but Ford would not let them until I made that call. The dealer said "we have to go through these steps before doing the throttle body" It was absurd really... I didn't ask, but it begs the question, why would they not do the black box first? And here's the thing about the misdirection that's starting to happen in this thread regarding safety... Cars rear end or other cars all the time. Stalled or not, shit happens because there is difference in speed between two vehicles. The thought that one has breaks and one is just stalling, so brakes will prevent blah blah blah is beyond stupid. My wife narrowly missed getting hit on the freeway... She also nearly got T boned because the car died pulling out onto a busy street (leaving her stuck sideways in traffic and a truck pulled into the next lane but the car behind it had it's view blocked and slammed on the brakes and missed them by a few feet... My wife said "When you children ask you what the nasty smell is and its the burnt rubber of the car that just missed you, you know it's time to stop driving the car"... This is a numbers game Ford... I appreciate you fixing our Edge and we've loved it so far but, much like GM have learned, you don't want to find out where the break even point is between fixing the problem and paying for bodies... I'm betting Ford step up. If your vehicle is stalling and not throwing codes, call Ford directly. Do that no matter what year the vehicle is. It's not like you are throwing your dealer under the buss. You are simply giving your dealer support by activating Ford. Ask for the blackbox test. Refuse any bullshit answer they give you. Document everything and let them know you are documenting everything... It will give Ford and the dealer proper incentive. Hope this helps... Be safe. This is exactly what I've been talking about all along regarding this fault being a pretty significant safety issue. Ford needs to step up and extend the warranty on the TB, issue a TSB or recall and fix this problem before someone's seriously injured or killed and they have to deal with a serious law suit, the resulting bad PR, loss of consumer confidence,and loss of sales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 30, 2014 Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 As I just pointed out in the other thread the warranty has already been extended to 10 yrs/150K miles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maavalous1 Posted October 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 akirby, Can you be a bit more specific? Which other thread? Warranty extended for what? I have only received a notice of warranty extension for Sync and a brake boot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixponies Posted October 30, 2014 Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 As I just pointed out in the other thread the warranty has already been extended to 10 yrs/150K miles. Can you provide more information on this, such as a TSB number, or other documentation showing where the warranty has been extended on this part? I've not seen anything on these forums about it, and I just did a quick Google search and found nothing about a TSB or extended warranty on the TB. There are, however, tons of complaints about this TB problem, because it's not isolated to the Edge. This TB was used in several models, including Escape, Edge, and F150. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 30, 2014 Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 Unfotrunately it appears the extended warranty only covers Escape, Fusion, Milan and Mariner. I don't know why it doesn't apply to the Edge. It also includes reprogramming the PCM to make it more tolerant of the failure condition. http://www.ncconsumer.org/news-articles/ford-issues-extended-warranty-to-cover-throttle-body-assemblies.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cman Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 (edited) Easily the worst part of this is Ford Motor making the dealers jump through repeated hoops... This issue is clearly very difficult to get a code, and the dealers had to be lead by me to the solution and not till after multiple stalls including a nasty situation on the freeway... It seems worse than dismissive (to the point of feigned ignorance) that when a car is having these same symptoms that ford doesn't immediately instruct the dealership to do the Black Box. Sending Family's back out on the road 2-3-4 times? Suggesting the Extended warranty is a key here (WHICH IS NOT DONE FOR THE EDGE) misses the point a bit although it's not as dumb as someone suggesting "stalling out isnt that dangerous because other cars have brakes"... Edited November 4, 2014 by Cman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjacomet Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Hi All, I too have the stalling issue and do believe it is the Throttle Body unit. I have a little over $41K miles on my 2013 Edge. I called Ford and of course there is nothing they will do about it, I have to take it to my dealer for repair. BS on that! I am interested in forcing FORD to recall the part. They obviously know that the part is defective and choose to do nothing about it. I was almost rear ended this morning with my child in the car. This is the 6th or 7th time it has happened and I am pissed! Anyone else interested in this little force play? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 And just how do you propose to "force" them to issue a recall? Only the NHTSA can do that and so far they've agreed with Ford that it doesn't warrant a recall. If you're so concerned about safety then why haven't you fixed it already? Why would you wait for it to happen 6 or 7 times? The part is less than $200 and a 15 minute swap at most. I completely agree that Ford should extend the warranty but don't pretend it's about safety when clearly you just don't want to pay for the repair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maavalous1 Posted December 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 OK... so we now know that akirby is a troll. And, that he's never bought or installed a throttle body. Moving on... The only way we could "force" action from Ford would be a class action suit. Which, in my experience, means that a lawyer will get a LOT of money and we'll all get a voucher for $20 off the repair. Sad... but most often true. Remember the Pinto... Ford hasn't really grown up much since then it would appear. Truly sad when the quants tell management "we can pay out any lawsuits for less than the cost of a recall". As for me, I can make my decision about Ford very easily now. Known problems, known low-cost solution, NO ACTION. Says all there is to say about Ford. I've put a new TB in my budget and taken Ford off of my list of quality cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Speaking the truth doesn't make me a troll. Just because something breaks doesn't mean a mfr has to fix it outside the original warranty period and if you think only Ford does this you're sadly mistaken. You can't claim it's a life or death safety issue and then wait while it happens 6 or 7 times to get it fixed. Fix it, pay for it then figure out your options for getting reimbursed from Ford. I said I think Ford should cover it with an extended warranty but that's a far cry from a safety recall. Given that the NHTSA has forced recalls for owner's manuals and floor mats I think its safe to say that they typically err on the side of caution and they don't think it's a safety issue. This would be more understandable if it was a $4K engine or transmission. And no - I have not installed a throttle body myself but several people on the fordfusionforum.com website have and that's where I got the info on the part cost and time to install. If you think it's different on the Edge then explain why, otherwise don't make assumptions about where people get their info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waldo Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Remember the Pinto... Ford hasn't really grown up much since then it would appear. Truly sad when the quants tell management "we can pay out any lawsuits for less than the cost of a recall". By "not grown up", do you mean they still base their decisions on actual hard facts and not just media hype? Ford has taken action on throttle bodies for the 2.3 and 3.0 engines in the Fusion and Escape. That means they have done the analysis and determined that there is a problem on those ones that warrants action. Do you really think they didn't think to do the same analysis on the 3,5? Do you think there's any car company (or any company at all) out there that doesn't follow the "we can pay out any lawsuits for less than the cost of a recall" philosophy? If you know of one, please let me know, so I can be sure to avoid buying their stock! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wv11point Posted December 2, 2014 Report Share Posted December 2, 2014 Throttle body failure...Hello all, new to this forum. Wife said her 2011 Edge stalled out on her 2 weeks ago. I got home from work...looked it over a bit...drove the snot out of it...all good. It conked out on her again yesterday...took it to dealer today...TB failure. She has over 50,000 miles on it...not covered under warranty they say. Has this problem been solved with the replacement parts or will it happen again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 On the Fusion there is a new TB part number. Can't say for sure about the Edge TB - could be a different part number. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wv11point Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 Thanks akirby...I have been thinking about paying off my Edge early and buying a new vehicle for me...but why buy a new one when the most reliable vehicle I own is nearly 40 yrs. old. (See my "current vehicle") This is our 2nd Edge 1st was a 2009...both bought new and 1st Ford for us. We were proud to buy from a company that didn't ask for taxpayer bailout. My mind may be changing...thinking about rebuilding another OLD vehicle for wife and getting rid of the Edge...may be less trouble in the long run Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixponies Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 (edited) The defective TB part # is T4Z9E926-A. The replacement TB part # is T4Z9E926-B. I found a brand new replacement TB on eBay for ~$120 shipped a few months ago. The link is below. The seller is in Puerto Rico, but he ships quickly. I received the TB in about three days in IL from PR. It was easy to swap out. It took me maybe about 1.5 hours, and that included installing a K&N cold air intake at the same time. I've been running the new TB for a few months now, and the problem hasn't returned. Before I pulled the trigger, & ordered it, I talked to Dingo (a good friend of mine) about it. He had his TB replaced under warranty a little over a year ago, & hasn't experienced the problem at all since. So if you're out of warranty and at all mechanically inclined, I'd recommend getting one from this seller & changing it yourself. You'll save a ton of $$$ compare to having it done at an independent shop or the dealer.http://www.ebay.com/itm/161476285370 Edited December 3, 2014 by sixponies 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 Is that the same TB that the Fusion uses? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixponies Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 Is that the same TB that the Fusion uses? I don't think so. From the research I've done on part # AT4Z9E926B throttle body, it's used on Ford/Lincoln models equipped with the 3.5L and 3.7L V6 engines (Edge/MKX, Mustang, F150, Taurus, Flex, MKZ, and Explorer). I know that the 2011-2012 Fusion Sport also has the 3.5L V6, but everywhere I've looked, it says that this part number won't fit the Fusion, even when I select the Sport model with the 3.5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 Well that's another reason why the Fusion extended warranty wouldn't apply to the Edge. But it does seem like a very similar problem so maybe once Ford gets a number of these failures on the Edge they'll do a similar warranty extension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wv11point Posted December 4, 2014 Report Share Posted December 4, 2014 Appreciate the part # info sixponies...expecting to get Edge back from dealer today...will post update on which part # they install and perfomance results etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wv11point Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 Got the Edge back about a week ago..."B" version of throttle body installed...doing well so far 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWPerfA_ZN0W Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 Just throwing this out there ... problems with the ETB have been noted with the 2007-10 Edge as well according to this thread. http://www.fordedgeforum.com/topic/3835-idle-speed-fluctuations/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Care Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 2011 Edge, just less than 62,000 miles Vehicle lost power pulling out in traffic and would not accelerate and the yellow wrench appeared on the instrument panel. Restart engine and back to normal (this happened 3 times trying to get home). The third time the Service Engine Soon light came on and I was able to pull the codes and had a P2111 and a P2112. Reached out to Ford Yesterday via PM and had a reply later that day from Tricia recommended taking my vehicle to the dealer to get diagnosed and she would look into it on her end. First I would like to say thank Ford for the prompt response. I have made the choice to order the new OEM Ford throttle body (P/N: AT4Z9E926B) and repair it myself seeing how i only have CPO powertrain coverage. I have always done my own service and just can’t bring myself to pay a higher price for the part, labor and taking time off to get it to a dealer. My wife is an LBK amputee and just started driving after 12 years away and this was kind of a setback as now she needs reassurances that the Edge is safe; luckily I was driving when it happened; she would have freaked out. Anyways the part should be in on Thursday so I’ll drive it for some time and see if it corrects the problem and report back. I would like to add for the poster who doesn’t think it is an issue. The first time this happened I was pulling out on a very busy street that you have to be a little aggressive to pull out (no one wants to let you in). I looked for an opening, get on it to pull out and it died with a car approaching fast with nowhere to pull over. So glad we didn’t get rear ended but I have to say I’ll be a little gun shy to pull out in the Edge for a bit. I’m not sold on the “Drive by wire” that’s for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixponies Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 2011 Edge, just less than 62,000 miles Vehicle lost power pulling out in traffic and would not accelerate and the yellow wrench appeared on the instrument panel. Restart engine and back to normal (this happened 3 times trying to get home). The third time the Service Engine Soon light came on and I was able to pull the codes and had a P2111 and a P2112. Reached out to Ford Yesterday via PM and had a reply later that day from Tricia recommended taking my vehicle to the dealer to get diagnosed and she would look into it on her end. First I would like to say thank Ford for the prompt response. I have made the choice to order the new OEM Ford throttle body (P/N: AT4Z9E926B) and repair it myself seeing how i only have CPO powertrain coverage. I have always done my own service and just can’t bring myself to pay a higher price for the part, labor and taking time off to get it to a dealer. My wife is an LBK amputee and just started driving after 12 years away and this was kind of a setback as now she needs reassurances that the Edge is safe; luckily I was driving when it happened; she would have freaked out. Anyways the part should be in on Thursday so I’ll drive it for some time and see if it corrects the problem and report back. I would like to add for the poster who doesn’t think it is an issue. The first time this happened I was pulling out on a very busy street that you have to be a little aggressive to pull out (no one wants to let you in). I looked for an opening, get on it to pull out and it died with a car approaching fast with nowhere to pull over. So glad we didn’t get rear ended but I have to say I’ll be a little gun shy to pull out in the Edge for a bit. I’m not sold on the “Drive by wire” that’s for sure. I've had this same problem. I ordered a TB and replaced it myself. I've had no problems since then, so you should be just fine after the repair. And I agree with you that this is a serious safety issue. Like you, I had it happen in a dangerous situation. Mine crapped out on me on a busy freeway where everyone was traveling 70+ MPH, and I was in the middle lane. I was very lucky to have not been hit by other traffic as I limped the vehicle across lanes to the shoulder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maavalous1 Posted June 23, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 Larry Care... so sorry to hear about your near-collision experience. That is why I started this thread. This is a SERIOUS issue that Ford is using to make service revenue. Just like the Pinto... so long as no one is killed, they make $$$. I have found two cash-cows they are using right now. The Throttle Body and the Door Latch. At 30K miles, my drivers door latch failed. If you search around you'll find this has been a problems with Ford for YEARS and they don't change it. In any case... on your doing your own TB replacement. A friend of mine works at Advanced Auto Parts. He handles the commercial accounts so I asked him to get the inside skinny from one of his Ford dealer customers. He told me that the story he got was two new bits of info: 1) it is the controller, not the TB as a whole that is defective. So, never fall for the "it just needs cleaned" story. Dealers have tried to sell me a $65 cleaning every 15K miles as a preventative. That's BS. Yes, eventually... maybe around 100K miles... a cleaning is a good idea. It will NOT prevent the failure. 2) That they have to "flash" the controller after it is installed. My friend didn't have a lot of details but thought that it is because it's a generic controller for a lot of different cars and the fine tuning is done in the computer. I have not verified that further but you should check on this if you're doing your own repair to be certain. God help us all... Ford is out to get us with the TB issue!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Care Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I've had this same problem. I ordered a TB and replaced it myself. I've had no problems since then, so you should be just fine after the repair. And I agree with you that this is a serious safety issue. Like you, I had it happen in a dangerous situation. Mine crapped out on me on a busy freeway where everyone was traveling 70+ MPH, and I was in the middle lane. I was very lucky to have not been hit by other traffic as I limped the vehicle across lanes to the shoulder. Glad to hear, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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