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Beezz

2015 turn signal switchback bulb issue

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I am running into a very strange issue with these bulbs. When the engine is not running they operate normally, when the engine is running they flicker/strobe whenever the turn signal is activated.

See the attached videos:

 

Hazard ON, Engine OFF (same applies for turn signal activation)

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3KiK2mnNJqFZURfdFdpNEwzaVk

 

Hazard ON, Engine ON (same applies for turn signal activation)

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3KiK2mnNJqFU282N2JGWUxjdXM

 

Switchback function demo:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3KiK2mnNJqFZ1VwT0l1dVFjRWc

With headlights on they are dimmed to white, turn signal activates amber flashing

 

In all cases it doesn't matter what lighting mode is selected, when the engine is off the turn signals don't flicker/strobe , when the engine is on they do flicker/strobe. I have tried using an inline resistor and it did absolutely nothing. I have seen the turn signals work properly when the engine is running, but its once in a blue moon.

 

Anyone know what is going on?

Edited by Beezz

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I believe you could get this to work by reprogramming the module that stores turn signal indicator lamp functionality (IPC?, maybe BCM). And disabling the bulb out notification. Though that's not the actual issue i believe it's what causes the hyper flash. I think jmr061 has done this on his '16

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It does seem as though the resistors are not wired correctly (maybe)?

 

All functionality appears normal when engine is off. What brand bulbs are you using?

 

I have tried MULTIPLE brands of switchbacks (JMT, VLED, eBay) and only the diode dynamics have worked properly and I have been using them for well over a year (not so much a plug for them as they just work flawlessly for me).

 

I have a 2012, but I still had to wire a resistor in on both sides/turn bulbs of the car.

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Not trying to hijack this thread but I thought 15+ used the single filament 7440?

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It does use a single filament bulb. What LED are you using? I just checked my 16 and do not have the pulsating while the vehicle is running. Is it actually doing this that you can see with the naked eye or just the video?

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Can I have a link for these switchbacks?

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I believe you could get this to work by reprogramming the module that stores turn signal indicator lamp functionality (IPC?, maybe BCM). And disabling the bulb out notification. Though that's not the actual issue i believe it's what causes the hyper flash. I think jmr061 has done this on his '16

I'll probably have to ask the dealer to reprogram it then, the thing is, it doesn't seem like hyper flash because the rest of the lights signal properly. Like the switchbacks work properly when the key is in acc mode and the car is in gear, just not when the engine is running.

 

 

It does seem as though the resistors are not wired correctly (maybe)?

 

All functionality appears normal when engine is off. What brand bulbs are you using?

 

I have tried MULTIPLE brands of switchbacks (JMT, VLED, eBay) and only the diode dynamics have worked properly and I have been using them for well over a year (not so much a plug for them as they just work flawlessly for me).

 

I have a 2012, but I still had to wire a resistor in on both sides/turn bulbs of the car.

They were plug n play resistors with the 7440 connectors on both ends (one melted after being on for 1 minute LOL) I tried plugging them in, in both directions, same with the bulbs, but the bulbs wouldn't even power on with the resistors installed. The bulb out indicator went out though, so the resistors do work.

They are a set of AutoEC 744X bulbs. Could you link me to the diode dynamics bulbs.

Edited by Beezz

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It does use a single filament bulb. What LED are you using? I just checked my 16 and do not have the pulsating while the vehicle is running. Is it actually doing this that you can see with the naked eye or just the video?

 

the bulbs : https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B017LHF2P2/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1\

 

It actually pulsates like that to the naked eye.

 

 

Can I have a link for these switchbacks?

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B017LHF2P2/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1\ I wouldn't buy them until this issue gets sorted out though
Edited by Beezz

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Sorry I posted not realizing your links had video

Clips (I had just woken up). Definitely doesn't seem to be a software issue.

 

I am interested to hear if you figure out a fix / find a better brand. I want a set of these

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Yeah I don't think it is software related either but surprises do happen. What concerns me is how does the switchback operate? The OEM bulb is single filament which would dictate power and ground. Guessing the parking light function is sent a lower voltage and the turn signal at a higher voltage. I didn't use a switchback LED in mine and have no issues. I am just thinking things out loud at this point. I would test the wiring for the bulb socket and compare that to how the LED is supposed to function?

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Yeah I don't think it is software related either but surprises do happen. What concerns me is how does the switchback operate? The OEM bulb is single filament which would dictate power and ground. Guessing the parking light function is sent a lower voltage and the turn signal at a higher voltage. I didn't use a switchback LED in mine and have no issues. I am just thinking things out loud at this point. I would test the wiring for the bulb socket and compare that to how the LED is supposed to function?

What are you using?

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Sorry I posted not realizing your links had video

Clips (I had just woken up). Definitely doesn't seem to be a software issue.

 

I am interested to hear if you figure out a fix / find a better brand. I want a set of these

I think the bulbs might just be defective, I ordered another set just to be sure. If they dont work the second time around then its definitely got to do with the factory wiring.

 

 

Yeah I don't think it is software related either but surprises do happen. What concerns me is how does the switchback operate? The OEM bulb is single filament which would dictate power and ground. Guessing the parking light function is sent a lower voltage and the turn signal at a higher voltage. I didn't use a switchback LED in mine and have no issues. I am just thinking things out loud at this point. I would test the wiring for the bulb socket and compare that to how the LED is supposed to function?

 

The bulbs should be operating with the 3 separate connections in the 7440 connector, but since the oem bulb was single filament, 1 wire supplies the power to 2 connections, so it would indicate one connector gets a constant voltage when the parking lights are on, and the other gets a higher voltage with the turn signal. (there could be 2 wires running through the 1 sleeve though) However the factory bulbs do have a different connection than these leds, I think the oem bulbs have 1 less connecting wire coming out of them. The switchback should be getting a constant voltage from one connector and alternating voltage from another. I'll be sure to check the voltage when I get the new set of bulbs, dont want to deal with the housings taking 50 minutes to get back in xD.

 

 

Anyways: yesterday this was happening :headspin:

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3KiK2mnNJqFVktTdlB1TlJubmcThey work for 5 seconds, then flicker, then work again... I wouldn't care if they flickered, as long as it is a consistent flicker it won't look odd.

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I tried the new set of bulbs, same issue. I used a multi meter to check the voltage from each terminal in the socket and couldn't get any readings. Guess I will have to custom wire them next spring.

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I just installed the below eBay switchbacks in my wife's 2015 Mustang, and wondering if they are the correct ones for my 2017 Sport - can anyone confirm this for me?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/7444-7443-Switchback-LED-Bulbs-WHITE-AMBER-Dual-Color-Turn-Signal-Lamp-Light/192443860151?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

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The 2015-2018 Edge uses WY21W bulbs for the front signals, they are the same as 7440NA. The 2015 Mustang uses 7444NA, it seems that physically they fit, but they may or may not work. One main difference is that 7440 is a single filament bulb, park & signal are achieved by changing the light output intensity (not sure how, probably varying voltage). 7444 has dual filaments. This site claims that LED 7443 can replace 7440, if true then you can use the Mustangs LED bulb. Better check with the seller.

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21 hours ago, omar302 said:

The 2015-2018 Edge uses WY21W bulbs for the front signals, they are the same as 7440NA. The 2015 Mustang uses 7444NA, it seems that physically they fit, but they may or may not work. One main difference is that 7440 is a single filament bulb, park & signal are achieved by changing the light output intensity (not sure how, probably varying voltage). 7444 has dual filaments. This site claims that LED 7443 can replace 7440, if true then you can use the Mustangs LED bulb. Better check with the seller.

It looks like the 7440 switchbacks have a separate wire to power the white LED's while the turn signals are not on - I'm not too keen on that arrangement, and not sure that it will actually work on the Edge due to the low voltage/intensity when the turn signal is not on.

 

http://store.ijdmtoy.com/No-Hyper-Flash-7440-LED-Light-Bulbs-p/20-101.htm

 

http://store.ijdmtoy.com/Single-Filament-7440-LED-Switchback-Installation-a/597.htm

 

7440-Philips-LED-Switchback-LED-Bulbs-03

 

 

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Instead of switchbacks, I was wondering if there is a possibility to disable the front parking light (the one with the signal bulb) and keep the signal (and side marker), it seems to be redundant since there is already the signature lighting from the bumper.

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12 minutes ago, omar302 said:

Instead of switchbacks, I was wondering if there is a possibility to disable the front parking light (the one with the signal bulb) and keep the signal (and side marker), it seems to be redundant since there is already the signature lighting from the bumper.

your post has a lot going on here.
1. you cannot run switchbacks in the 15-18 Edge.
2. If you have HID, your DRL is where the highbeam would be if you didn't have HID, Yes the DRL can be turned off perm. If it's not an option in your left cluster menu, you have to use Forscan.

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11 minutes ago, Nick Halstead said:

your post has a lot going on here.
1. you cannot run switchbacks in the 15-18 Edge.
2. If you have HID, your DRL is where the highbeam would be if you didn't have HID, Yes the DRL can be turned off perm. If it's not an option in your left cluster menu, you have to use Forscan.

 

I meant only the parking light bulb that is shared with the turn signal, can it be made to only function as the turn signal & then to turn off when the parking lights are on. If it were a dual filament bulb then I'd just disconnect the wire for the parking light.

 

DRL is a separate issue, not related, though for my Edge as it has HID I have a separate bulb for it & I already replaced it with a LED bulb.

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12 hours ago, Nick Halstead said:

your post has a lot going on here.
1. you cannot run switchbacks in the 15-18 Edge.

 

Actually you can... you can use the specific model switchback linked above which provides a separate wire to power the white LEDs when used with a 7440 single filament socket that normally would not allow the second power source, or you can make your own with a 7443 dual filament socket (about $8 per pair) spliced in place of the factory 7440 single filament socket so that you now have the needed extra wire for the white side circuit.  You'd have to figure out how to power that side but finding an ignition switched circuit shouldn't be too hard.

 

But you're right - there is no plug-and-play way to make switchbacks work.

 

 

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@TheWizard

A normal switchback would usually get power for parking light all the time, and temporary for the signal. Hence in parking light mode (1 power source) the bulb is white. In turn signal mode (2 power sources simultaneously) the bulb goes Amber Intel the 2nd power source stops for some set period of time. 

 

The thing with the Edge's 7440 bulb, the single filament will always have power whether it was in parking light mode or turn signal. So how would the switchback bulb know it is not in turn signal mode? Unless it was specifically designed for this case (varying output single filament). 

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Good point! However, I have downloaded the lighting schematic and it shows separate wires at the headlamp assembly for turn signal and parking lights.  I don't have an Edge of this year to look at but I wonder if the two inputs are managed within the headlamp assembly to control the single filament bulb.  The schematic shows a blue/green wire as turn signal input at the left headlamp and a yellow/purple wire as turn signal on the right side.  Both sides have a separate blue/gray wire for parking light input.  That would mean that disconnecting the blue/gray wire on each side should prevent parking light activation in the bulb and allow the separate wire on the switchback to control the white circuit.

 

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