Major Upgrade (Rewrite) Details

[wlepse]

My heated seats make me have to poo.

You sir will never be offered a ride by me.

 

Got to watch the video last night with sound and am starting to get hopeful about the improvements. I really didn't want to because I am afraid of being dissapointed. I just hope the unit in the video was stock hardware and not that MX51 CPU one article mentioned.

[Radioguy]

any links to the "people who have had little or no problems" and "other forums"

Thanks

We've had our Edge Ltd for a little over a month. Other than the voice recognition not being all that great we have had no other issues. iphones even work every time. Not trying to defend Ford, obviously MFT was released far too soon. The consumer should not have to do the debugging.

[mrdave]

Simple - the old one was written by BSQUARE using Flash. The new one was written by Ford and Microsoft and doesn't use Flash. It's totally new, more efficient software. The old software - at one point - had 1500 bugs. Never should have been released but the new Edge was fully dependent on it so Ford took a gamble they could stabilize it within a couple of months. They lost and they're paying the price.

So I came across this guy's website while searching MFT articles and it seems that the rewrite is still using Flash. It also sounds like Ford again contracted the work out to other companies, Teleca and Wild Card Ventures LLC, instead of doing it in house.

 

http://www.jeffjoneslive.com/MyFord-Touch-Sync.asp

 

Any ideas on what's going on here? Did Ford not learn their lesson the first time??

[Waldo]

So I came across this guy's website while searching MFT articles and it seems that the rewrite is still using Flash. It also sounds like Ford again contracted the work out to other companies, Teleca and Wild Card Ventures LLC, instead of doing it in house.

 

http://www.jeffjoneslive.com/MyFord-Touch-Sync.asp

 

Any ideas on what's going on here? Did Ford not learn their lesson the first time??

 

Sounds like Microsoft contracted out the work to other companies. Ford doesn't do very much software in house. Engine controls, brake controls, body modules, pretty much every piece of software in a Ford car is written by suppliers.

[akirby]

So I came across this guy's website while searching MFT articles and it seems that the rewrite is still using Flash. It also sounds like Ford again contracted the work out to other companies, Teleca and Wild Card Ventures LLC, instead of doing it in house.

 

http://www.jeffjoneslive.com/MyFord-Touch-Sync.asp

 

Any ideas on what's going on here? Did Ford not learn their lesson the first time??

 

If you read the last couple of paragraphs Microsoft was directing the work so Ford was contracting with Microsoft. I was surprised to hear they're still using Flash however. I'd like to see something from Ford or Microsoft to confirm this.

[cal3thousand]

So I came across this guy's website while searching MFT articles and it seems that the rewrite is still using Flash. It also sounds like Ford again contracted the work out to other companies, Teleca and Wild Card Ventures LLC, instead of doing it in house.

 

http://www.jeffjones...-Touch-Sync.asp

 

Any ideas on what's going on here? Did Ford not learn their lesson the first time??

 

Thanks for the info!

 

The beginning of that article was promising but I was left a bit disconcerted after finishing the article. I am concerned that there are idiots fixing the system. It seems like Jeff Jones is make or break for the MFT system since he is (purportedly) doing everything.

[wlepse]

Oh man...now I am back to being pessimistic on this update. According to that write up flash is still an integral part and maybe just as important so is bSquare??? What was Ford thinking keeping them in the mix? At least he did mention some of the processing was pushed to the video card which will help but makes me wonder if this will be a big enough step to make this thing run efficiently will all the features Ford promised.

[akirby]

Oh man...now I am back to being pessimistic on this update. According to that write up flash is still an integral part and maybe just as important so is bSquare??? What was Ford thinking keeping them in the mix? At least he did mention some of the processing was pushed to the video card which will help but makes me wonder if this will be a big enough step to make this thing run efficiently will all the features Ford promised.

 

Where did it say BSQUARE was involved? It was contracted to Microsoft, not BSQUARE.

 

And while I have reservations about them continuing to use Flash, I'll wait and see the final product before jumping to conclusions. I don't think Ford is stupid enough to have a repeat occurrence.

[wlepse]

Where did it say BSQUARE was involved? It was contracted to Microsoft, not BSQUARE.

 

And while I have reservations about them continuing to use Flash, I'll wait and see the final product before jumping to conclusions. I don't think Ford is stupid enough to have a repeat occurrence.

Just before the section saying Challenge: "We were responsible for importing, adjusting the layout and implementing new features while working along with bSquare developers and Microsoft team members that mainly focused on updating external .as files so we could work on the .fla files in parallel."

[akirby]

Just before the section saying Challenge: "We were responsible for importing, adjusting the layout and implementing new features while working along with bSquare developers and Microsoft team members that mainly focused on updating external .as files so we could work on the .fla files in parallel."

 

Totally missed that. Now I have no idea what's going on, but the demo sure looks promising.

[wlepse]

I guess what has me feeling uneasy is one article mentioning the CPU to be the iMX51 but I could swear the original APIM was an iMX31. Since the demos have been on 2013 models they may have made a change to the CPU to help and that could be why the responsiveness looks so much better. Normally I would chalk it up to someone getting a detail wrong but it seems nothing with this rewrite is clear. Seems everything we thought Ford was doing they weren't. I did send an email to the guy who wrote the article mentioning the iMX51 but he is out of the office on vacation.

[wilsons66604]

This resume is a great find!

Kind of depressing though.

Oh well. It's got to be better though....Right?

 

 

Right?

[SonomaDriver]

A reskin is a far cry from fixing the bugs which have plagued this software.

[AXCL]

A reskin is a far cry from fixing the bugs which have plagued this software.

 

Based on the details, Jeff's job was the reskin, but there was more to it. .flv files can contain more advanced code, but from the sounds of it, he was doing the graphics and layout of the screens, which is the main purpose of these .flv files. MS and bSquare were updating .as files, which is action script, this is the commands that are run when you press a button. Jeff was to make the new interface look and was given details like, when you press the driver seat button, run "driverheatseat.ai", but what that does is irreverent to him. It is the rewrite of these .ai files that is the real software update. Items like the phone and ipod (bluetooth & USB) links would have nothing to do with the Flash programming, these are OS (Operating System) or device driver changes which is the underlying MS Auto (aka Windows CE) and the MS SYNC application, so he likely wouldn't have even been aware changes to this realm.

 

The OpenGL is also a biggie. It is underlying software that allows Flash to use hardware acceleration for graphics, rather then using the main CPU resources, usually 3D stuff. This part may have had the largest effect on the entire MFT. If you can free up CPU resources, then you're a lot less likely to bog it down and make it slow, mess up commands or even crash and do the reboot. Think of it as having a turbo under the hood, but its not connected, so your car never uses it. That little 2.0 ecoboost will perform like crap if they forgot to connect it. Connect it up and its like a new engine. Open GL hardware acceleration is built into almost every video processor on the planet now, why they weren't using it before??? This is only one of the hundreds of "Why didn't they .....?" questions we have, but we'll likely never no the answer.

 

This guy seems to know what he's doing, so having one guy do most of the interface may even be a good thing. This resume, certainly doesn't look good for Ford though, as it still shows a complete lack of project skills in software. Who would outsource a Flash project to a company with no Flash developers?? This Jeff guy, may actually be our savior!

Edited November 23, 2011 by AXCL

[wlepse]

A reskin is a far cry from fixing the bugs which have plagued this software.

I wonder if people contracted to help were required to stick to the corporate line that the system was fine and worked well just needed the screens updated to make it easier to use.

 

Based on the details, Jeff's job was the reskin, but there was more to it. .flv files can contain more advanced code, but from the sounds of it, he was doing the graphics and layout of the screens, which is the main purpose of these .flv files. MS and bSquare were updating .as files, which is action script, this is the commands that are run when you press a button. Jeff was to make the new interface look and was given details like, when you press the driver seat button, run "driverheatseat.ai", but what that does is irreverent to him. It is the rewrite of these .ai files that is the real software update. Items like the phone and ipod (bluetooth & USB) links would have nothing to do with the Flash programming, these are OS (Operating System) or device driver changes which is the underlying MS Auto (aka Windows CE) and the MS SYNC application, so he likely wouldn't have even been aware changes to this realm.

 

The OpenGL is also a biggie. It is underlying software that allows Flash to use hardware acceleration for graphics, rather then using the main CPU resources, usually 3D stuff. This part may have had the largest effect on the entire MFT. If you can free up CPU resources, then you're a lot less likely to bog it down and make it slow, mess up commands or even crash and do the reboot. Think of it as having a turbo under the hood, but its not connected, so your car never uses it. That little 2.0 ecoboost will perform like crap if they forgot to connect it. Connect it up and its like a new engine. Open GL hardware acceleration is built into almost every video processor on the planet now, why they weren't using it before??? This is only one of the hundreds of "Why didn't they .....?" questions we have, but we'll likely never no the answer.

 

This guy seems to know what he's doing, so having one guy do most of the interface may even be a good thing. This resume, certainly doesn't look good for Ford though, as it still shows a complete lack of project skills in software. Who would outsource a Flash project to a company with no Flash developers?? This Jeff guy, may actually be our savior!

Good points. I really hope this rewrite does solve the problems or at least brings us close to what Ford claims it to be. To your point about Ford PM skills...I think it does get difficult to really know what capabilities companies have. I know in my own project work I try to stay with vendors I know have delivered before because anyone can promise the world. All this is new to Ford so they might not know the right questions to ask, but with that said since the first version was a failure you would think they would have been more diligent in their vetting process.

[akirby]

I wonder if people contracted to help were required to stick to the corporate line that the system was fine and worked well just needed the screens updated to make it easier to use.

 

They did not just update the screens. Don't confuse corporate PR statements with reality.

 

Good points. I really hope this rewrite does solve the problems or at least brings us close to what Ford claims it to be. To your point about Ford PM skills...I think it does get difficult to really know what capabilities companies have. I know in my own project work I try to stay with vendors I know have delivered before because anyone can promise the world. All this is new to Ford so they might not know the right questions to ask, but with that said since the first version was a failure you would think they would have been more diligent in their vetting process.

 

Ford went to Microsoft and Microsoft contracted this guy's company, not Ford. Ford realized their mistake and went to Microsoft to fix it. I'm not sure what else they could have done that would have been better.

[wlepse]

They did not just update the screens. Don't confuse corporate PR statements with reality.

 

 

 

Ford went to Microsoft and Microsoft contracted this guy's company, not Ford. Ford realized their mistake and went to Microsoft to fix it. I'm not sure what else they could have done that would have been better.

I never said they only updated screens the other poster mentioned this...I just said they may not be able to discuss any other changes due to a contract. Ford is working very hard to make it appear as if this is an upgrade to make it easier for people to use the functionality. Not an upgrade to make it actually function.

 

If Ford really did their due diligence you would think bSquare would be out of the picture all together. But regardless of who Ford may or may not have contracted it is still their responsibility to know that the people involved can actually pull off what they need done.

[akirby]

If Ford really did their due diligence you would think bSquare would be out of the picture all together. But regardless of who Ford may or may not have contracted it is still their responsibility to know that the people involved can actually pull off what they need done.

 

Things like this are usually complicated and we don't really know what role bsquare is playing in the rewrite. I trust Ford and Microsoft not to make the same mistakes that were made the first time.

 

You're really getting yourself all wound up over who's doing what and what type of hardware is being used, etc. - before anyone really has seen the production version of the system. Can we just wait and see how it turns out?

[richy]

Things like this are usually complicated and we don't really know what role bsquare is playing in the rewrite. I trust Ford and Microsoft not to make the same mistakes that were made the first time.

 

You're really getting yourself all wound up over who's doing what and what type of hardware is being used, etc. - before anyone really has seen the production version of the system. Can we just wait and see how it turns out?

 

 

akirby, I agree with you. Before you wrote this, I was going to post that it's silly to get all anxious over something that we don't know how it will perform. Be patient and hopeful that Ford will finally get this right. Having shitty JD Power scores is a huge kick in the teeth that they do not want to repeat. That is their biggest source of motivation is to get those numbers back to where they were.

[wlepse]

You're really getting yourself all wound up over who's doing what and what type of hardware is being used, etc. - before anyone really has seen the production version of the system. Can we just wait and see how it turns out?

We don't have a choice but to wait. I am just trying to educate myself on what has been done and have pointed out several inconsistences. And excuse me for getting wound up; maybe the reason I am wound up is I paid $37K+ for a Ford because of this technology. Honestly if it wasn't for this bit of tech I would never have looked at Ford.

[Edgieguy]

Do you think the new update will include any fixes for us Canadians and being able to use sync services and apps?

 

If they didn't, I'd be happy to help anyone up north

[mrdave]

And excuse me for getting wound up; maybe the reason I am wound up is I paid $37K+ for a Ford because of this technology.

Agreed 100%. We paid a LOT of money for these vehicles and we have every right to be upset until we have a system that ACTUALLY WORKS.

[akirby]

Agreed 100%. We paid a LOT of money for these vehicles and we have every right to be upset until we have a system that ACTUALLY WORKS.

 

So if you'd only paid HALF that much do you think it would be ok? If somebody paid twice as much as you should they be twice as upset?

 

I'd be upset if Ford wasn't attempting to fix it. It appears that not only are they attempting to fix it but they're improving it at the same time.

 

Who did the coding and the exact hardware details are moot as long as the product works and all indications are that it does. Until someone can prove that it doesn't it's silly to give yourselves a heart attack worrying about it.

[wlepse]

So if you'd only paid HALF that much do you think it would be ok? If somebody paid twice as much as you should they be twice as upset?

 

I'd be upset if Ford wasn't attempting to fix it. It appears that not only are they attempting to fix it but they're improving it at the same time.

 

Who did the coding and the exact hardware details are moot as long as the product works and all indications are that it does. Until someone can prove that it doesn't it's silly to give yourselves a heart attack worrying about it.

I don't think anyone is that invested to make themselves sick. I agree they are trying to fix it and it does appear as if it works in the videos but all inidications of the initial release were good too. And as I pointed out previously there is a lot of conflicting info as to what was done. For quite some time you were sure bSquare was out as well as flash, we now know that isn't true. You also seem to be sure the hardware hasn't changed but one article specifically references another more powerful processor. So my point is that our initial indications that it is a vast improvement in perfromance may not be an apples to apples comparison since they may have made hardware changes. I hope they haven't but if they have the performance on the older systems may not be as good.

 

To your first question...sort of. This isn't a linear relationship but if I pay $10k for a car I am not expecting much and can live with little quirks.

[akirby]

I don't think anyone is that invested to make themselves sick. I agree they are trying to fix it and it does appear as if it works in the videos but all inidications of the initial release were good too. And as I pointed out previously there is a lot of conflicting info as to what was done. For quite some time you were sure bSquare was out as well as flash, we now know that isn't true. You also seem to be sure the hardware hasn't changed but one article specifically references another more powerful processor. So my point is that our initial indications that it is a vast improvement in perfromance may not be an apples to apples comparison since they may have made hardware changes. I hope they haven't but if they have the performance on the older systems may not be as good.

 

I'd like to see more corroboration than just one blogger. But yes, the earlier info could be wrong.

 

My point is that who coded it or what hardware they used is moot and irrelevant as long as the final product works as advertised. So let's wait to see if it works or not to start stressing out about it.